MINUTES
BUDGET PUBLIC HEARING
TUESDAY, MAY 8, 2007, 7:00 P.M.
PRESENT: =
&nb=
sp; Elaine
Adams (arrived at 7:13 p.m.)
&=
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p; &=
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p; Antonio
Guerrera
&=
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p; Carl
Mancini
&=
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p; Joseph
Pawlak, Chairman
&=
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p; &=
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p; Suzan
Plowman
&=
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p; &=
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p; Raymond
Primini
&=
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p; &=
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p; Paul
Rinaldi, Vice Chairman
&= nbsp; &nbs= p; &= nbsp; &nbs= p; Jack Walton
ABSENT: =
&nb=
sp; Robert
Kane
OTHERS PRESENT: Gina Calabrese, Board of Education
&= nbsp; &nbs= p; &= nbsp; &nbs= p; Mary Dzioba, Chairman, Board of Education
&= nbsp; &nbs= p; &= nbsp; &nbs= p; Joseph Erardi, Superintendent of Schools
&= nbsp; &nbs= p; &= nbsp; &nbs= p; Charles Frigon, Town Manager
&= nbsp; &nbs= p; &= nbsp; &nbs= p; Todd Griffin, Secretary, Board of Education
&= nbsp; &nbs= p; &= nbsp; &nbs= p; Kevin Killeen, Board of Education
&= nbsp; &nbs= p; &= nbsp; &nbs= p; Chris Lafferty, Board of Education
&= nbsp; &nbs= p; &= nbsp; &nbs= p; Richard Mazzamauro, Board of Education
&= nbsp; &nbs= p; &= nbsp; &nbs= p; Frank Nardelli, Assistant Town Manager/Finance Director
1.&nb= sp; Convene Public Hearing - 7:00 P.M.
Mr. Pawlak, Chair= man, called the Budget Public Hearing to order at 7:00 p.m.
Mr. Pawlak, Chair= man, read aloud the following Notice of the Public Hearing for the record:
NOTICE OF BUDGET PUBLIC HEARING
FISCAL YEAR 2007/2008 BUDGETS
The
legal voters of the Town of
Budget Public Hearing
May 8, 2007
Page 2
The Town Council proposes:
A. Town General Fund &= nbsp; &nbs= p; &= nbsp; $2= 1,701,383
B. = School General Fund &= nbsp; &nbs= p; &= nbsp; $33,769,261
&= nbsp; General Fund Total &nb= sp; = &nb= sp; $55,470,644
C. Town Road Aid &nbs= p; &= nbsp; &nbs= p; &= nbsp; $ 121,341
D. Water Operations &nb= sp; = &nb= sp; = $ 1,311,293
E. = Water Capital = &nb= sp; = &nb= sp; $ 157,750
F. = Water Extension &nbs= p; &= nbsp; &nbs= p; &= nbsp; $ 59,0= 62
G. Sewer Operations &nb= sp; = &nb= sp; = $ 1,869,461
H. Sewer Capital = &nb= sp; = &nb= sp; $ 138,500
I. &= nbsp; Sewer Extension &nbs= p; &= nbsp; &nbs= p; &= nbsp; $ 30,0= 00
J. &= nbsp; Water and Sewer Debt = ; &n= bsp; = ; $ 136,400
K. Crestbrook Golf Operations &nbs= p; &= nbsp; $<= span style=3D'mso-spacerun:yes'> 684,058
L. = Crestbrook Improvement Trust &n= bsp; = ; $ 84,0= 00
M. Local Capital Improvement = &nb= sp; = $ 156,283
Copies
of the proposed budgets will be available at the Budget Public Hearing and =
also
may be picked up during business hours at the Town Hall Annex,
Dated
at
____________________________
Joe Pawlak, Chairman
RETURN OF NOTICE
TOWN OF
NOTICE OF PUBLIC HEARING
I =
hereby
certify that on April 26, 2007 I left a duplicate copy of the attached Noti=
ce
of Budget Public Hearing,
I = further certify that on April 26, 2007, I caused a copy of said Notice of Public Hearing to be published in the Town Times, which newspaper has a substantial circulation in said Town.
I =
further
certify that on April 26, 2007, I caused to be set upon the signpost or oth=
er
exterior places nearest the Office of the Town Clerk and all other places a=
nd
signposts designated by the Town, a written copy of said Notice of Public
Hearing signed by the Town Manager of the Town of
Budget Public Hearing
May 8, 2007
Page 3
I = further certify that all of the above acts took place at least five (5) days before= the holding of the Public Hearing on May 8, 2007.
Da=
ted at
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&= nbsp; &nbs= p; &= nbsp; &nbs= p; &= nbsp; &nbs= p; = Charles A. Frigon, Town Manager
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Town
of
TOWN CLERK’S CERTIFICATION AS TO
NOTICE OF PUBLIC HEARING AND RETURN OF NOTICE<= /p>
I hereby certify that the attached Notice of Budget Public Hearing and the foregoing Return of Notice of Budget Public Hearing are duly recorded in the records = of the Town of Watertown, Connecticut, and that Joe Pawlak was Chairman of the= Town Council on the date the Notice was signed and that Charles Frigon was Town Manager on the date the Return of Notice was signed..
Dated
at
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&= nbsp; &nbs= p; &= nbsp; &nbs= p; &= nbsp; &nbs= p; Virginia Russo, Assistant Town Clerk
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p; Town
of
Mr. Pawlak: There will be a presentation from = the Board of Education and the Town with respect to the budget which is proposed at $55,470,644, and I'm going to ask the Board of Education, since they have t= he lion's share of the budget, about 60% or so, to open up and give us a presentation with respect to their request.
Joseph Erardi, Superintendent of S=
chools
Dr. Erardi: I prepared for the Town Council, a= nd you have the hard copy in front of you, and our community members that are here this evening a very, very brief presentation. As I scan the audience I know many= of you have already seen the presentation in part. I'll go quickly and I know the que= stions will be the important part of tonight's agenda.
This just illustrates for the community who is serving on the Board of Education= and our Budget Subcommittee that put in hours and hours and hours of work under= the direction of Mary Dzioba the Board of Education Chair, and Todd Griffin, the Chairman of the Budget Subcommittee along with Mary Colangelo, Richard Mazz= amauro, and most of the time nearly all of our Board Members attended our budget committee meetings.
The (inaudible) from 01/02 to 06/07 I'm not going to read that for you, but wha= t it results in is a loss of 27 positions over the 5 year span. What you see here are the programs= that are also lost, the alternative program at the high school, the talented and gifted program in full, along with our professional reductions, our non-certified staff, with our custodians, maintenance and so on down, compu= ter assistants, and our hall monitors.
Budget Public Hearing
May 8, 2007
Page 4
Last year was the beginning of the recapture with the Watertown Schools and you = can see that driven by the accreditation issue which everyone in this room is a= ware of as you've heard about it now for 2 years, the accreditation drove at the high school 3 additional teachers, additional technology support which we w= ere able to bring on this past Winter. At the Middle School bring back a full time Librarian. At Heminway Park 2 teachers which reduced class size to 27 and 26 students and at John Trumbull a need for one additional teacher due to enrollment.
The
per pupil expenditure, this is something that has been a bit debated public=
ly
in our local newspapers and (inaudible) I did share with membership how the
calculation takes place, it's a complicated calculation. This tells you that the per pupil
expenditure for the State of
The
historical data, again just illustrates that at 167 to 168 to 169 and I'd l=
ike
to talk about what DRDG means. It's
a reference group, or socioeconomic group in the State of
The
DRG which we just spoke about and the comparative data for the mill rate in
local communities, you can see
The
plan behind the 07/08 budget would be budget priorities by the Board of Edu=
cation,
first and foremost through our Curriculum & Instruction Committee and t=
hen
embraced and adopted by the Board of Education was the accreditation of
This is an important slide and I want to just take a moment so the community can understand this. You have a h= ard copy which might be a little easier to follow. Although we fix our own fixed costs= by contractual obligations, health insurance, transportation with our bus comp= any and you can see our energy that we plan to spend, our water and sewer and t= he Vo-Ag which we're obligated to pay for for any student who wants to go to a Vo-Tech program, you can see that the fixed costs in the budget for this ye= ar supersedes the proposed additional asking dollar, which is a very interesti= ng slide. The difference, which = you can see, we're at 101% with an expenditure and with our fixed costs compare= d to our proposed additional dollar.
Budget Public Hearing
May 8, 2007
Page 5
An important slide for educators, for parents, and I think for this community,= our projection for class size. It= 's very difficult to project middle and high school because students move so m= uch. You can see that our class si= ze is looking in the low to mid 20's in nearly all of our grades and this is a nu= mber that is moving in a direction that we're also proud of.
Enhancements
in the budget, at Watertown High School the proposal that you have in front=
of
you is looking to recapture a lost school counselor, we're adding an English
educator and we're bringing back what we think is a very important program =
in a
very economical way, a regular ed program after school for the average
child. We need to address our=
drop
out rate at
Very quickly just a pie chart and you can see we're driven by human resource and= we are like any other local Board of Education, driven by human resource.
An interesting slide in regards to the additional funding that we are expecting from Education Cost Sharing. = In the Governor's proposed budget, we've been watching this closely, there is an addition, approximately $1,500,000 which was initially targeted for Waterto= wn Schools.
The additional money you can see in the bar graph, in 07/08 again is a projecti= on.
(Inaudible) increase, no different than the pie chart you just looked at in regards to = contractual obligations and employee benefits, both areas that we're looking to do our = best work to control costs.
The next 2 slides represent, and you can look at the two pages that you have in front of you of where the additional expenditures and where the savings are taking place for 07/08 and we're hoping that if you have questions, as a community member give our office a call and we'll do our best work to answer your questions.
Budget Public Hearing
May 8, 2007
Page 6
If
you're looking at the snapshot of what the Board of Education has presently=
in
place, after a reduction from the Town Council, this is the picture that I
think represents the best information. You can see that the percentage inc=
rease
as we sit tonight is a 5.82% increase.&nbs=
p;
You can see, as I mentioned earlier, that the Educational Cost Shari=
ng,
the additional money projected for
What does this all mean? What it m= eans is with the State reimbursements, with the present proposed budget, that we= are looking at less than a 1%, it actually comes out to a 0.99% increase, tax increase to our community, to our electorate. What that looks like overall as a = mill increase is a 0.2 mill increase. That represents the Board of Education's 07/08 budget, and it's taki= ng into consideration the meetings that we had and the endorsement that took p= lace probably by the Town Council. Again it's a 5.82% increase overall, it's less than 1% to the community as a projection and it comes to you as a 0.2 mill increase.
At this particular time I don't know if there are questions from the Town Coun= cil or additional comments from the Board of Education members. Thank you.
= ; Mr. Pawlak: We will now proce= ed with the Town's side of the budget and I'll turn that over to Carl Mancini,= the Chairman of the Budget Subcommittee.
Carl Mancini, Chairman, Finance
Subcommittee, Town Council
Mr. Mancini: Good evening. I apologize, I don't have an overh= ead for you tonight. I was led to believe that we weren't doing overheads, so I didn't prepare an overhead because I was told we weren't going to be doing it, but I'll do a verbal presentation.
We started out with the budget requests from the Town that equaled $1,110,000, an increase of 5.31%. The Board of Education wanted $2,0= 44,712 which was a 6.41% increase, for a total of $3,155,153 or a 5.97% and that w= ould have equated to a .6 mill increase. The Budget Committee met and we pared that down.
Some
of the highlights of this new budget includes, we put an additional $75,000
into the budget for property revaluation, that's going to be coming up and =
we have
to pay for that. The Planning=
and Zoning
Department is receiving a new Secretary, about $26,000. The Fire Department is receiving a=
new
Budget Public Hearing
May 8, 2007
Page 7
Volunteer Fire Department, we're increasing their per diem from $5.50 to $6.00 per call. It's not a lot but it s= till (inaudible) 9% increase. Park= s, Veteran's Field Soccer II drainage, there is a problem up there, $32,500 th= at we were able to put in there. They also needed a rotary mower for $5,000.&nbs= p; Parks also needed a (inaudible) $4,500. There is a full time Data Processi= ng Assistant, an additional $26,000 put into that account. The Library was increased an addit= ional $25,000 to $725,000, and the Fire Department Vehicle Replacement Fund which= was cut last year down to $100,000 was put back to $125,000. Those are just some of the highlig= hts of the budget for the year.
We have debt services that are $4,816,925.&nb= sp; The Town's portion of the debt service is $1,613,364 which is 33% of= the debt service. The Board of Ed= ucation's portion is $3,203,561 which is 67% of the debt service.
The Finance Subcommittee recommended budget of $55,470,644. It's an increase to the Town (inau= dible) 5.05% of which the Town's portion was $805,548, the 3.86% increase in the B= oard of Education increase over last year's was an additional $1,858,712. Like Dr. Erardi said, a 5.8% increase. I just want to repo= rt that the school budget increase is 70% of the total budget increase. For those of you don't know, I thin= k Mr. Pawlak did say that the school budget is approximately 60% if the overall budget, it's 60.9% of the overall budget.&= nbsp; It was 60.4% last year. And the only thing I'm going to disagree on with Dr. Erardi is that he said that the Educational Cost Sharing is $1,510,000, we've been told that it's going= to be reduced by another $148,000 so our cost sharing dropped down to $1,361,9= 71. That's what I have. (Inaudible.) Are there any questions right now?=
Ms. Adams: Carl, when you talked about Paved = Rehab Section IX, you said that we increased it by $98,000?
Mr. Mancini: Yes . . . .
Ms. Adams: No, that is actually a decrease of = fifty . . . .
Mr. Mancini: Section IX, $98,000.
Ms. Adams: Yea, it's actually a decrease, beca= use this year we had $150,500, so it's a cut of $52,500?
Mr. Mancini: Frank, is that right?
Mr. Nardelli: Yes.
Ms. Adams: From this year to next year, that's= the amount that was budgeted, but it was cut.
Mr. Mancini: Yea.
Ms. Adams: Right, it wasn't an increase.
Budget Public Hearing
May 8, 2007
Page 8
David Minnich,
= ; Mr. Minnich: I have four comm= ents, four areas. One, I want to th= ank you for the P & Z Secretary that you are funding. We have been looking forward to th= is for several years, and given the both the workload and the (inaudible) of our records needing to be filed properly we than you for that.
I
also want to bring to your attention as a second item on the Torrington Area
Health District. The amount of
dollars that you have in the budget that has been requested by the Health D=
istrict
is just $100,485. In addition=
to
that contribution that's being requested, (inaudible) Town of
The third issue is regarding the Fire District and I was saddened to see that t= he Council is not funding two items that the Fire District, for purposes of wh= at we perceive to be equity, has requested $55,000 for street lights and $73,0= 00 for fire hydrants. I remind y= ou as we had talked before, the issue of the street lights, every property taxpay= er in Town, including those in the Fire District, pay for all of the streets lights, excepting those in the Fire District, and those in the Fire Distric= t, the residents pay 100% of the cost of the streets lights for themselves is = in that Fire District plus those people in the Fire District also pay their sh= are as I mentioned outside, so that $55,000 that we take a look at our costs, in looking at our services, we don't provide a service of public safety or rea= lly have anything to do with streets, that is a Town function, that we have to = ask you to fund.
Budget Public Hearing
May 8, 2007
Page 9
In the area of fire hydrants, the very same logic. I'd ask the Town administration, a= nd they've been so kind to put together for me how much the Town Council, thro= ugh its general taxes of Town contributes directly as a transfer for fire hydra= nts to the Watertown Water & Sewer Authority, and in the coming year is $131,760. I went back 10 year= s and we're looking at $1,229,000 that has been paid by general taxes to the Watertown Water & Sewer Authority for use of its fire hydrant rentals.<= span style=3D'mso-spacerun:yes'> During that whole time up until now nothing has been paid to the Fire District, which also has fire hydrants an= d our request was for the payment of a fire hydrant rental that was even less than the Water & Sewer Authority's. Bottom line, that total would be $73,000. I don't see either one of those fu= nded. (Tape #1, Side A ended - may have = missed some.) in that from our perspective we probably should be smacking ourselve= s in the face a little bit by saying why haven't we woken up earlier to these co= sts that are not functions of the Fire District but are functions of the Town, which is fire protection is a function of the Town as well as street lighti= ng.
The last comment I have is I see on the revenue side of your budget, $600,000 f= or sale of properties and I question very sincerely the public policy that has been in this budget with regards to using the sale of capital items such as= in this case 2 schools, well 1 school and another area (inaudible) to finance = the operating budget. I would thi= nk that should be placed in a capital reserve used for some capital that you a= s a Town Council wish to fund, and suggest to the residents they do that. The issue becomes quite obvious to everyone here. Before we begi= n the budget in a year from now we're $600,000 in the hole so to speak by having = that one time revenue not being used. If the revenue, that $600,000 was put directly into a capital improvement, that the Council would like to do and the residents would also like to approve, = that would be the wisest use of those funds in my opinion. Thank you.
Raymond Primini, Town Council
Mr. Primini: Dave, I want to thank you abou=
t what
you said about the $600,000. =
Up
until now I thought I was the only one that figured that one out. I have a problem with supporting t=
his
budget. It sounds great that =
there
is a zero mill increase. If I
planned to live a year in this Town that would be great, if I planned to li=
ve
for a year that would be great. I
feel this budget is loaded with too much gimmicks, deferrals, we're countin=
g on
too many different things. As=
you mentioned,
Dave, that $600,000, that means we start off next year $600,000 in the hole=
. The other issue I have is with the=
sale
of that property on
Budget Public Hearing
May 8, 2007
Page 10
The other issue, this $1,300,000 we're told we're going to get from the State, = we don't know for sure if we're going to get that. In the past years the budgets we'v= e had, we've never known until the last minute how much money we've gotten. My father always taught me I never= count my money until I have it in my pocket.&nbs= p; It's $1,300,000, too many what ifs.= Too many items in this budget are loaded with leases that we never d= id before in the past. We've alw= ays purchased police vehicles, the fire vehicles, especially the Chief's car, t= he emergency cars were purchased. They're being . . . in the past years and this year they're being converted to leas= es. They're usually 3 year leases on t= hese vehicles, I'm afraid what's going to happen to this, when we get down to (inaudible) in the past we had deferred cars for awhile maybe put them off = for another year, it's just going to backfire on us. What is going to happen next year i= f the 3 school projects pass? That'= s an additional 2 mills right there. Next year, beware of what could happen to your budget. I'm scared what's going to happen = next year, we could end up with a 4 or 5 mill increase next year.
MaryAnn Rosa,
Ms. Rosa: Is it correct that there is going = to be 3 questions on the ballot on the schools, 3 separate ones?
= ; Mr. Pawlak: Yes.
Ms. Rosa: Am I also to assume that there are = going to be 2 questions on the budget?
Mr. Pawlak: Yes.
Ms. Rosa: So that would leave me the conclusi= on that we are going to ask people to go in to the voting booth and vote yes 5 time= s?
Mr. Pawlak: Yes, or no, or something in between= .
Ms. Rosa: Are we dreaming? We have a hard enough time getting= it twice, the Board of Ed and the Town, to ask them to vote yes 5 times is tot= ally unrealistic, in my opinion, and that's not to be construed as a criticism of anyone's opinion on how to place them on the ballot. I'm just very concerned, I'd like = to see it all pass, I support it all. My concern is that I think that's asking a lot of people to say yes 5 times and maybe you might want to find a way to look at that again, and put the schoo= l questions as 1 instead of 3 separate items. I think you're asking for trouble that way. Thank you for your time.
Mr. Pawlak: I just want to take this opportunit=
y, if
I may, to share with you some of my thoughts and thinking, the rationale be=
hind
what we attempted to do with this budget and why. I understand that there are concer=
ns as
to what may happen in the future, and I share those concerns. I would differ from my colleague R=
ay
Primini's concern or suspicion that we're using gimmicks or something with =
this
budget. We are not. We are contemplating selling some
property which the
Budget Public Hearing
May 8, 2007
Page 11
There's
no need for us to be, with respect to the
What our thinking was when we tried to hold the costs down, both our expenditures and because it's an equation that has to balance. With respect to the State, I atten= ded a dinner and the Senate Pro Tem, the present Pro Tem of the Senate spoke and = he was, discussed the issue, the Governor's budget which would have resulted in Watertown receiving about $1,510,000 in additional funding. His concern was the sustainability= of that particular problem and what I mean by that is it's all well and good i= f in fact that problem were passed in tact as it was presented for the next 2 ye= ars, and I believe it was a 2 year program, right Frank?
Mr. Nardelli: 2 years.
Mr. Pawlak: It was a 2 year program. There is a very real possibility t= hat after the second year the State could up and decide to de-fund that program= . What would happen then is if we had counted on all of that money and if we do count on all of that money and th= en go along and increase Town spending over and above so that instead of having a zero tax increase we would perhaps have a 2% or 3% or 4% tax increase or whatever. If and when that pr= ogram is de-funded, at that time all of those costs are built into all of our cur= rent costs. And it would be very, = very difficult and painful for us to try and cut those costs out of the budget, without, and if we were unsuccessful we would then have to raise taxes to c= over those costs. It happened back= in the 80's when the State funded significant increases for teacher salaries, which were warranted because they were well underpaid back then, but after several years, I think it was 5 or 6 years of State funding, they cut that = and that program and by that time all of the costs were in place and the towns = had to pick those costs up. I'm concerned that this kind of situation can happen.
Now, we have a bonding issue which is going to be presented on June 5th at referendum with the budget and it's a 3 school project, as many of your kno= w, about $84,000,000 and change. The impact of that on our taxes would be somewhere around 10% roughly. If the plan goes, and I do hope it does, because I think it's warranted, I thi= nk it's needed, when that expense would start to hit us as a town starting in fiscal year July 09, Frank is that correct?
Mr. Nardelli: Yes.
Budget Public Hearing
May 8, 2007
Page 12
Mr. Pawlak: So that's a 10% increase potential = that we're looking at. We also hav= e, as Carl alluded to in his discussion, re-evaluation and that is going to be completed, it's a sample, it's not a full blown evaluation with people knoc= king at your door, coming in and looking around, but that will be completed and = the effects of those of that evaluation will take place as of July 1, 2009. If everything holds true to form a= s it did in 2003/04, I believe it was the last time we had a revaluation like th= is we can expect some sort of tax increase, and I would suspect that it would probably be somewhere in the neighborhood of 10% to 20%. That's what happened last time, an= d that would take effect July 1, 2009.
In
addition to that (inaudible) still going on. We are very seriously looking at a=
Town
Hall. We have to do something=
about
our
And
then last but not least, we have the situation with the year to year tax
increases that most of us experience in very town in the State. In
So
as of July 09 if you look at the bonding issue, re-evaluation, town hall, y=
ear
to year increases that we could be experiencing, we could be looking at
somewhere in the neighborhood of a 30 - 35% tax increase by July of 2009.
Budget Public Hearing
May 8, 2007
Page 13
So it was with this whole picture in mind that we consciously made an effort to try and hold the line on tax increases, since we were able to. It wasn't, we didn't want to say w= e got $1,345,000 or whatever that number is from the State, let's spend that and let's get another 3% or 4% in additional taxes from the Town because there = are more things we'd like to do. = There are more things that I'm sure every one of us would like to do, but we have= to budget for it, we have to look out beyond this day, this week, this month, = we have to look to 3, 4, 5, 6 years to see to try and maintain some semblance = of fiscal responsibility so that when certain programs go, which I just discus= sed, come to fruition, and they will, you have to be prepared for them, you have= to take whatever steps are necessary on your part, every one of us as individu= als to be in a better position to handle those increases that are going to happen. There is nothing, you= can guarantee that between now and July of 09 you are not going to see a tax increase, that is not going to happen, again I don't think, but the questio= n is can we control it, can we keep it to a minimum. That's the logic that we used in p= utting this package together for consideration by the Town.
=
; Kevin
Killeen, Board of Education
=
; Mr.
Killeen: I've always atte=
mpted,
on my parent's advice, to do the right thing and to say the right thing.
There has been something that has been quoted too many times and I want to correc= t it right now. The past encumbran= ce to the people of this Town will not be $84,000,000. It's an $84,000,000 project that t= he State is paying nearly 57%, which puts the encumbrance of the people of thi= s Town at $37,000,000. It's a bargain. Like if I were to go= buy my house, if someone were to buy a house and somebody were to say hey Kevin, I= 'd like to pay half of it for you, what do you say? No, probably not, it's just silly,= it doesn't make sense.
Budget Public Hearing
May 8, 2007
Page 14
But I (inaudible) with respect to the Chairman, I listened to what he had to say and I felt that altogether too many times he made Mr. Primini's case. If we're projecting these gains in= taxes to, if I was sitting on that side and was in a position to say I could do a= no tax mill increase, the next thing I would say is I'm going to pull a rabbit= out of my hat, and I'm not a magician, I can't do that, and I don't think we sh= ould be attempting a zero mill increase either, only because it's going to come = back and it's going to be a real lump on the head to all (inaudible) and I'm concerned about the latter end of this year when we're trying to make our expenses on money that we never received, because it was reduced, or the building never got sold, something of that nature, some real genuine concer= ns that goes to the heart of who I am, as an ethical and moral person, for me = to sit here as a member of the Board of Education because I so desperately wan= t to see the buildings program go forward, and I really do. I think our children deserve it, it= would be wrong of me to say that I think there's, that this is a budget that does= n't need work. I originally felt = that it was a budget that we could work with, it sounded good, but when I found = out some things about it, I was no longer very satisfied about it. I want (inaudible) to look at me as= a citizen of this Town after I step down form the Board or whatever capacity = I'm in, and say you know what, at least the guy was (inaudible) and that's what I'll take to my grave. I'm not trying to sell you something that's not out there (inaudible). Thank you.
=
; Patricia
Chipko,
= ; Ms. Chipko: I heard you say t= hat you are supporting and you hope the schools pass, and I want to believe that. Could you explain to me= why you used the figure $84,000,000 when that's not what it is going to cost us, and why we're having 3 separate questions?
= ; Mr. Pawlak; The schools are g= oing to cost $84,000,000 and what Kevin said is correct, that we will be paying $37,000,000 and change. What I didn't say also which is correct is that the impact, that $37,000,000 on th= e Town will be about a 10% increase, and that was what I was referring to as the principal.
= ; Ms. Chipko: But it's just tha= t the people might hear that $84,000,000 and if we're trying to promote the schoo= ls to pass, and they hear that figure, it sounds a lot different.
= ; Mr. Pawlak: Well the fact of = the matter is the total project is going to cost $84,000,000, we know that.
= ; Ms. Chipko: But not to the To= wn.
= ; Mr. Pawlak: And we know the S= tate is going to give us 56% and we're going to have to make that public knowled= ge leading up to the referendum.
= ; Ms. Chipko: And the 3 questio= ns?
Budget Public Hearing
May 8, 2007
Page 15
Mr. Pawlak: The 3 questions, quite frankly, is because we, as a Council, believe, the majority of us, that choice was the = issue. All right? People deserve the opportunity to = make a choice. Hopefully everybody or enough people are going to say all 3 schools should pass. However, the alternative is if we = put 1 school or a 1 question item on the budget, it would be on the budget as an $84,000,000 package, okay? Th= at might scare people and they might not vote for it. I'm not going to say that all 3 are going to pass, I don't know, it's just my feeling, that having lived in Watertown since 72, practically without exception all of our budgets have always been a 2 question issue, the Board of Education and the Town. And it made sense for us.
Ms. Chipko: But you're splitting it even more by having 3 questions.
Mr. Pawlak: We're just giving the Town the choi= ce on a very large spending package.
Ms. Chipko: Can I ask what the Board of Educati= on's desire was for that question?
Mr. Pawlak: They wanted 1 question.
Ms. Chipko: And did they explain the reasons to= you?
Mr. Pawlak: Yes, and I explained my reasons and= what I felt the Town Council's reasons were.&nb= sp; It was a split vote.
Ms. Chipko: Was it a party vote?
Mr. Pawlak: No, 5-4.
Jack Walton, Town Council<=
u>
= ; Mr. Walton: Hear $84,000,000 = then we hear $37,000,000 and everybody forgets the bonding costs. Kevin . . . we did not mention tha= t will bring our total bill from $37,000,000 to around $55,000,000 and the State h= as a bad habit (inaudible) I would estimate that this school will end up costing= us, the taxpayers of Watertown, $60,000,000 by the time it's all over. But in any event, with the bonding costs, it's not going to cost us $37,000,000; it's going to cost us $55,000,000.
Mr. Pawlak: You're referring to the (inaudible) costs that will be (inaudible) bond issues.
= ; Mr. Walton: They come out of = our bonding.
=
; Paul
Rinaldi, Town Council
= ; Mr. Rinaldi: I'm under the impression that we're going to be spending (inaudible) explain the referend= um, how it's going to work, how many questions, the cost, (inaudible) of course it’s not going to be for or against, it's just going to be strictly informational, everybody (inaudible).
Budget Public Hearing
May 8, 2007
Page 16
= ; Mr. Pawlak: That's correct.
=
; Ms.
Adams: Here we go again,
budget. Just a comment that I=
have
that I think as we serve we keep learning new things, new items, things that
are funded, aren't funded, and this year I learned something with the Fire
District, with the street lights and the hydrants. It never dawned on me that we do
reimburse the Town of
I
have some concerns too as far as what has happened with the Public Works bu=
dget
and as far as things being deferred.
Now we have always tried, on the Public Works Subcommittee, myself, =
Paul
Rinaldi, and Ray Primini have been doing this for 5.5 years now, we've alwa=
ys
tried to do the best we can with the dollars given us, we have to do this
time. The concern is we have
nothing in this budget for maintenance of our roads. Now chip seal is one of those thin=
gs
that costs a lot less than asphalt, it's messier, but it does give you some
life on the road. (Inaudible) chip seal, crack seal, all of this stuff is g=
one,
the only thing that is left is the $98,000 to pave Section VIII which is
nothing, and then we've got master storm drains which is absolutely
necessary. We have cut storm
drainage facility, we've cut the chip seal, we've cut patch repair, all of
those are gone. I am concerne=
d that
next year at this time or next Winter when we need to do these things to get
out and repair potholes, we have nothing to do it with. We have very little money in here =
to do
anything as far as maintenance goes, it's just being deferred. But the one thing that bothers me =
more
than anything about this Public Works budget is, you may remember a very sh=
ort
time ago we had a bridge collapse in Town, and the Public Works Subcommittee
jumped on it, we were fortunate enough to get the State funding because it =
was
an emergency, and I thank God to this day that nobody was killed when that
happened. We have looked at t=
hat as
a Subcommittee, we did a study to find out the exact condition of our bridg=
es
because we get done basically, we have done nothing, nothing for years and
years on the (inaudible) of our bridges.&n=
bsp;
At Public Works we asked for $145,000 to repair, to fix the
Budget Public Hearing
May 8, 2007
Page 17
Gina Calabrese, Board of Education=
= ; Ms. Calabrese: This is my opi= nion, but I do believe strongly that (inaudible) significant portion of the Town's population is suspecting that the Town Council has chosen to solicit the 3 school projects (inaudible) in order to pit a section of the town against e= ach other and to ultimately derail the entire project.
= ; Mr. Pawlak: Gina you're entit= led to your opinion, I know that I personally did not attempt to split the ballot,= I don't see how we can split the Town, the High School serves every student ultimately in Town and Polk and Judson they have, let's see, they have 3, 4, and 5 in each school so that that is serving probably 50% of all the studen= ts (Tape #1, Side B ended - may have missed some). Never even thought of it until som= ebody else mentioned (inaudible). As I said, you're welcome to your opinion (inaudible).
= ; Ms. Calabrese: I just think t= hat we should view the Town as a whole, we should view the school system as a whol= e, and I think it psychologically sends a message that perhaps we should compa= re the value of fixing one school as opposed to another, I think it's just hum= an nature when splitting the vote. I don't think, I'm not saying that (inaudible) deliberate (inaudible), but I think it will weaken the viability of the entire project because it does gi= ve the Town pause then to think which is the worst situation, when we all suff= er everywhere in the Town and all students suffer cause all 3 of the schools a= re in disrepair. I just don't th= ink it's a way to unify the Town in any way, I think it is a way to split the T= own.
Mr. Rinaldi: I thought we were here tonight to discuss the budget, the referendum has already been discussed, debated, and voted on by (inaudible).
= ; Ms. Calabrese: I think this i= s a public forum and I think we have every right in the world to discuss someth= ing that is going to have, perhaps an indirect effect on the budget.
= ; Mr. Rinaldi: You have the rig= ht, I'm not saying you don't, you can express your opinion, but the reason I th= ink we're here tonight is to discuss the budget and the referendum (inaudible) Council (inaudible) had a long discussion.
= ; Ms. Calabrese: I think the fa= ct that we had at least 2 audience members bring this up would imply that it i= s on people's minds, and it is in the back of people's minds, and perhaps foremo= st in people's minds, many minds.
Mr. Killeen: With respect to that discussion, a= nd concerns about the 3 school studies, if you look at the budget and it's not= the same referendum that's why everybody at both tables has been kind of (inaudible) from the Chairman, each member has brought up the building and = so forth. It is a serious issue = and it's certainly my concern. Mr. Walton is correct, I didn't quote the cost of the bonds, primarily because I didn't know what the cost of the bonds would be and besides no one has ever quoted the cost of the bonds as a matter of either presenting a referendum = or in presenting this issue. I t= hink what we have to fall back on is that we have buildings that are falling apa= rt, and they have been falling apart for a very, very, very long time.
Budget Public Hearing
May 8, 2007
Page 18
Now there's been organizations that are in this Town who have fought our budgets until the budgets were minimalized and we are back doing maintenance like we should and that sort of thing, is the first thing that stopped. Isn't that true, Mr. Walton? I ask that question (inaudible) bu= t it is important for me to state that costs according to our architect will go = up minimally 7%, that's building costs this year, 7% (inaudible) additionally. Inflation rises= at the rate of about 3.5% on average. There is no value to that inflation rate in this budget or (inaudibl= e) costs for doing building repairs if we don't take care of them. Will it cost $55,000,000? Perhaps. Will it cost $80,000,000 with the State's additional (inaudible) by their $80,000,000 5 years from (inaudible)? Most certainly.<= span style=3D'mso-spacerun:yes'> We keep putting these things off a= nd they keep getting more expensive, they don't get cheaper. When the roof leaks, we fix it, wh= en the boiler is broken, you replace it. And this is the Town we're supposed to live in, a place that's like literally falling apart. Now = we should be penny wise, pound foolish and 10 years down the road pay a lump s= um increase or be taken over by the State like some other cities close to us t= hat have, and it was because everybody was worried about that tax increase, that value (inaudible) increase, it's just the wrong approach to put these things off and not to expect that there be inflation in a budget. I'm sorry, that's not reality.
Sandra Greenwood,
Ms. Greenwood: Both my husband and I really like =
the 3 question
proposal and I hope it stays like this.&nb=
sp;
I myself like to have a choice of what I want to vote for, and I do =
in
my heart of hearts believe that this referendum is going to pass. I can't believe that people are go=
ing to
say I want
= ; Mr. Pawlak: Anyone else want = to comment? Okay, thank you very= much ladies and gentlemen.
3.&nb=
sp; Adjournment
Mr. Pawlak, Chairman, Closed the Public Hearing at 8:10 p.m.
Respectfully Submitted,
Joseph Pawlak, Chairman
&= nbsp; &nbs= p; &= nbsp; &nbs= p; &= nbsp; &nbs= p; = Town Council
A= pproved: _______________________________
Lynn M. LaF= orme, Clerk