MINUTES
CONSERVA=
TION
COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR
MEETING
JOHN TRU=
MBULL
PRIMARY SCHOOL MEDIA CENTER
THURSDAY,
FEBRUARY 10, 2005 - 7:30 PM
PRESENT: =
; &n=
bsp; =
; Bernard
Beauchamp
=
&nb=
sp; =
&nb=
sp; Glenn
Duplissie
=
&nb=
sp; =
&nb=
sp; Ron
Jones, Secretary
=
&nb=
sp; =
&nb=
sp; Joseph
Polletta
=
&nb=
sp; =
&nb=
sp; Charles
Thermer
=
; &n=
bsp; =
&nb=
sp; Edwin
Undercuffler, Vice Chairman
=
&nb=
sp; =
&nb=
sp; James
Zawadzki, Chairman
ABSENT: &nbs=
p; &=
nbsp; &nbs=
p; =
None
ALTERNATES PRESENT: =
; Martha
Sturgis
ALTERNATES ABSENT: =
; Susan
Atwood
=
&nb=
sp; =
&nb=
sp; Peter
Peluso
OTHERS PRESENT: &n=
bsp; =
; Moosa Rafey, Assistant
Zoning Enforcement Officer
1. =
Call
Meeting To Order
Mr.
Zawadzki, Chairman, called the Regular Meeting to order at 8:07 p.m.
2. &nb=
sp; Roll
Call
Mr.
Jones, Secretary, executed the Roll Call.
3. =
Election
of Offices
=
; Mr.
Zawadzki: In
conducting a poll before the meeting each of the sitting officers are willi=
ng
to continue in their current positions, however in spite of that fact, we
accept nominations from the floor, and we’ll start with the Chairmans=
hip.
&=
nbsp; MOTION: (Mr.
Polletta, sec. Beauchamp) to nominate James Zawadzki for Chairman of the
Conservation Commission/Inland Wetlands Agency.
&=
nbsp; Discussion: MOTIO=
N (Mr.
Beauchamp, sec. Mr. Duplissie) to Close the Nominations. &=
nbsp; &nbs=
p; &=
nbsp; Discussion: None<=
o:p> &=
nbsp; &nbs=
p; &=
nbsp; MOTION
PASSED UNANIMOUSLY &=
nbsp; MOTION
PASSED UNANIMOUSLY CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY REGULAR MEETING FEBRUARY 10, 2005 PAGE 2 &=
nbsp; MOTION: (Mr.
Polletta, sec. Duplissie) to nominate Edwin Undercuffler for Vice Chairman =
of
the Conservation Commission/Inland Wetlands Agency. &=
nbsp; Discussion: MOTIO=
N (Mr.
Beauchamp, sec. Mr. Duplissie) to Close the Nominations. &=
nbsp; &=
nbsp; &nbs=
p; Discussion: None<=
o:p> &=
nbsp; &nbs=
p; &=
nbsp; MOTION
PASSED UNANIMOUSLY &=
nbsp; MOTION
PASSED UNANIMOUSLY &=
nbsp; MOTION: (Mr.
Beauchamp, sec. Duplissie) to nominate Ronald Jones for Secretary of the
Conservation Commission/Inland Wetlands Agency. &=
nbsp; Discussion: MOTIO=
N (Mr.
Beauchamp, sec. Mr. Duplissie) to Close the Nominations. &=
nbsp; &nbs=
p; &=
nbsp; Discussion: None<=
o:p> &=
nbsp; &nbs=
p; &=
nbsp; MOTION
PASSED UNANIMOUSLY &=
nbsp; MOTION
PASSED UNANIMOUSLY 4. =
Public
Participation None 5. =
Action
on Minutes &=
nbsp; A. Continuation
of Public Hearing, May 10, 2001, App. #415, Cathie Caton &=
nbsp; B. =
Continuation
of Public Hearing, May 10, 2001, App. #421, YMCA &nbs=
p; C. Continuation
of Public Hearing, May 10, 2001, App. #422, Mary Ann Cathcart &=
nbsp; D. Public
Hearing, May 10, 2001, App. #423, Mark Lovely &=
nbsp; E. =
Public
Hearing, May 10, 2001, App. #424, Domenic DiNunzio &=
nbsp; F. =
Public
Hearing, May 10, 2001, App. #425, New Millennium Development, Inc. &nbs=
p; G. Regular
Meeting, May 10, 2001 &=
nbsp; H. Continuation
of Public Hearing, July 12, 2001, App. #423, Mark Lovely &=
nbsp; I. &=
nbsp; Continuation
of Public Hearing, July 12 2001, App. #424, Domenic DiNunzio &=
nbsp; J. &=
nbsp; Continuation
of Public Hearing, July 12, 2001, App. #425, New Millennium Development, In=
c. &=
nbsp; K. Public Hearing July 12, 2001, App. #428, Echo La=
ke
Watertown LLC &n=
bsp; L.<=
span
style=3D'mso-tab-count:1'> =
Regular
Meeting, July 12, 2001 CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY REGULAR MEETING FEBRUARY 10, 2005 PAGE 3 M. Continuation
of Public Hearing, January 13, 2005, App. #505, Guernseytown Farms, LLC Pha=
se
III &=
nbsp; MOTION: (Mr.
Polletta, sec. Mr. Beauchamp) to Approve Item 5A through 5G and 5M through =
5O
and Table Items 5H through 5L. &=
nbsp; Discussion: None<=
o:p> &=
nbsp; MOTION
PASSED UNANIMOUSLY 6. =
Pending
Applications A. Application #514 of Watertown Board of Education,
Swift School Improvement Project, Colonial Road, Oakville, CT. If a Public Hearing is
Closed on February 10, 2005, then a decision is required by April 17, 2005.=
Mr. Zawadzki: =
We Closed the Public H=
earing
so we can either vote on this now or Table it until our next meeting. Any discussion? Mr. Undercuffler: It seems pretty well=
set,
doesn’t it? Mr. Rafey: They addressed all t=
he
issues. Mr. Zawadzki: I don’t have any
questions at this point. MOTION:<=
span
style=3D'mso-tab-count:1'> (Mr.
Undercuffler, sec. Mr. Beauchamp) to Approve Application #51 Discussi=
on: None<=
o:p> MOTION P=
ASSED
UNANIMOUSLY CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY REGULAR MEETING FEBRUARY 10, 2005 PAGE 4 B. =
Application
#516 of Frank Stack for reconstruction of an access way to remove junk cars=
and
cleanup garbage from a regulated area at 300 Smith Pond Road, Watertown, CT=
. If a Pub=
lic
Hearing is not held, the a decision is required by February 11, 2005. Mr. Duplissie: I’m the one that
requested this site visit, but I didn’t get my notification so I
wasn’t there. Moosa was=
kind
enough to take me on Tuesday for a site visit, so I apologize for not being
there on Saturday. Mr. Zawadzki: It’s not a
problem. It’s not a rea=
l big
project, but still it was interesting to see. Any questions? Mr. Undercuffler: He was supposed to su=
bmit a
sketch, wasn’t he? Did =
you
get that? Mr. Rafey: No, I didn’t re=
ceive
a sketch for the dock and the masonry for the well. Fr=
ank
Stack, 300 Smith Pond Road, Watertown, CT&=
nbsp;
06795 Mr. Stack:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> I totally forgot. I’ve just been busy. I had to get to the airport and pi=
ck up
my kids, it’s no excuse, but I could have it in to you tomorrow.
Mr. Rafey: =
But for the dock as long as it is t=
he
same size and in the same location, you cannot make it larger, I don’t
see a problem to make a condition.
It will be same size masonry or stone work on the well.
Mr. Stack: =
Yea, there will be nothing bigger, =
maybe
just put a peak on it so water will run off, instead of having a wooden doo=
r on
it.
Mr. Duplissie: My only concern when I did the site visit was th=
ere
was an existing pathway, or roadway that was kind of, probably an old tract=
or
path through the woods for the old farm, but when I walked it, the roadway =
is
basically on the property line. I
think if you’re walking in from the road, the right hand side is
basically the property line.
Mr. Stack: =
Right, pretty close.
Mr. Duplissie: =
It looked like that anyway. But at one point there’s pro=
bably
about 70 to 80 feet there was some excavation done on that road in order to=
get
your trucks in and out so that they wouldn’t roll over when you were =
removing
the debris.
CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 10, 2005
PAGE 5
Mr. Stack: =
The trucks weren’t brought in=
from
the road part. That’s w=
hen I
was going out with a machine, and it was a heavier machine than a tractor a=
nd
it started to sink so it was pull myself out with the backhoe on it so rath=
er
than disturb anything anymore; that’s when Moosa came up and I stoppe=
d on
it.
Mr. Duplissie: =
Cause it looks like there’s a=
cut
there if you’re walking in from the road, on the left hand side of the
road, it looks like there is a cut of about 2 feet, in order to make that
roadway level. And I could be
wrong, but I saw the roots sticking out and I saw that there was some wood
chips. My only thing is IR=
17;d
like it put back, the only reason is is that if it’s put back to the
angle that it was, then we won’t have to worry about continuous
transportation back and forth on that road.
Mr. Stack: =
Well it’s not going to be
continuous, but in case I want to hay it, mow it, keep the property down.
Mr. Duplissie: =
My question is is that that passage=
way is
in the 50 foot buffer, so are you supposed to be in that 50 foot buffer, are
you supposed to be transporting or driving?
Mr. Zawadzki: <=
/b> The main concern of course is excav=
ation
and disturbance and unfortunately any of that was already done when Moosa w=
as
alerted to this activity so essentially Mr. Stack ceased his work there at =
the
time when Moosa went out to visit and he covered the area of wood chips and
basically our concern now is since it’s kind of an after the fact thi=
ng
is to prevent any further excavation and disturbance in that 50 foot buffer
area beyond this point.
CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 10, 2005
PAGE 6
Mr. Stack: =
I would like to interject one more
thing. There is also old moto=
rs
that are absolutely sunk in the ground and the only way to lift them out of=
the
ground is to go down there with a backlight, I have pictures of them here, I
just took them tonight, it was about quarter to six when I took them, got t=
hem
developed and brought here, and I would like to go in there and pull out all
the garbage, I have kids that like to go play in wetlands area, frogs,
whatever, and they’re going to be down there, there’s just no t=
wo
ways about it, and you can see through the pictures and glasses, and
there’s huge bottles.
Everything predates, Tom Traver was saying tonight that goes back to=
the
50’s, they used to have a drunk old lady who threw all of her garbage=
and
stuff there and he said the people across the street up until recently were
coning over and dumping down into the hayfield which they stopped before I
bought the property. TheyR=
17;ll
give an affidavit to that affect for me.
Mr. Zawadzki: <=
/b> Well that’s a rubber tire veh=
icle
isn’t it?
Mr. Stack: =
Yea, so once I . . . . .
Mr. Zawadzki: <=
/b> And you’re not doing excavati=
ng,
you’re just driving on the existing access way.
Mr. Stack: =
Right.
Mr. Undercuffler: And that was a pre-existing road,
wasn’t it?
Mr. Stack: =
Yea, I asked them that too. They said the reason the row of tr=
ees,
if you’re walking in on the left hand side they grew up because there=
was
a fence line there and everything was thrown over the other side, and they
would hay the bottom part and it was just a connecting for lack of a better
word, Arlene said I don’t remember, Tom said yea, it was a road, I pi=
cked
up stuff there. I said fine,
whatever you want to say, I’ll just tell them down there. Now I’ve heard that I’m
supposedly need an access road there.
I’ve got 800 feet of frontage at the hayfield, I don’t n=
eed
to come in through a, basically an encroachment on a swamp whatsoever, I am
cleaning the place up, that’s all I intended to do. There’s some orange burnt pi=
pe
that is 12, probably 18 inches and I have the roots that are, I’ll gi=
ve
you these pictures and you can look at them, the roots are growing over the
pipe, the roots are this big, I want to remove those, they’re all
collapsing and it serves no purpose whatsoever. Anything that was put there previo=
us to
wetlands I want to just clean it up.
CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 10, 2005
PAGE 7
Mr. Zawadzki: <=
/b> Well our concern is disturbance and=
I
think that from what I’ve seen if you’re not planning excavation
and that sort of thing, it really wouldn’t qualify as disturbance, wh=
at
you have in mind. If we issue=
you a
permit for what’s already been done, then that would take care of tha=
t,
unless you’re planning to go in in the future and do some additional
disturbance, in which case you would need a different permit.
Mr. Stack: =
Not at all. I just want to, as soon as the wea=
ther
breaks, and it’s good enough just to landscape it, put it the way it =
is,
seed it, be done with it, pick up the rest of the glass, and like I said,
here’s pictures, you can go down there and pull up 5 or 6 buckets ful=
l of
glass and debris still in there.
Mr. Polletta: <=
/b> You have motors in there now?
Mr. Stack: =
Yes, there’s engine blocks, m=
otors.
Mr. Polletta: <=
/b> They are there now?
Mr. Stack: =
Yes.
Mr. Zawadzki: <=
/b> They were covered up with snow when=
we
were there.
Mr. Stack: =
Yea, and if you want the pictures .=
. . .
.
Mr. Rafey: =
Can I have the pictures, I want to =
keep
them in the file. Not all of =
them,
just the ones that you . . . . .
Mr. Zawadzki: Why don’t you keep a copy.
Mr. Stack: =
This is one engine block here, you =
can
see the cylinder there and that’s buried in the ground, just sitting
there. There’s still tr=
actor
parts, still bed frames. You =
can
see the big (inaudible) just growing across the tree there. They’re growing straight up,=
so
they’ve been there the better part of (inaudible). This is I guess where we’re
talking on the cut, I can’t plant these trees that big, and it is wha=
t it
is.
Mr. Zawadzki: Is there any other question as far as wetland
impact? Essentially that was a
farmer’s access road which of course was permitted in its day. It’s kind of a road to nowhe=
re,
it’s only usable on that property.
CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 10, 2005
PAGE 8
Mr. Rafey: =
Just for your information, there is=
a grant
of conservation restriction between Mr. Stack and the Town of Watertown
regarding this property. Item=
G
says that the two docks referred to in the above referenced court judgment =
can
remain and can be repaired and maintained by the grantor, which is Mr.
Stack. If you want to make a
decision on this, please make a condition that can be only repaired, not
enlarged or replaced. You can=
not
change the location, just the existing dock that is there they can repair i=
t.
Mr. Undercuffler: Where is that easement actually?
Mr. Rafey: =
For the entire property, I think th=
ere is
. . . . . .
Mr. Stack: =
On the conservation easement, it=
217;s
100 x 400 feet on the water itself, so if I ever go to subdivide or do anyt=
hing
further, I have to remove 4 of the cottages and put the front, the shoreline
back to almost its original condition, except for one cottage with lifetime=
use
goes along to Tom and Arlene Traver, the people that I bought the property
from, so there’s nothing I could do with that other cottage. Basically 4 of the cottages which =
are,
you saw them . . . . .
Mr. Duplissie: =
So they have lifetime use and the a=
ccess
is through the road that is going to be by the barn?
Mr. Stack: =
They can access the property though=
any
part of the 800 feet on the road.
Mr. Duplissie: It looked like there was activity in a couple of=
the
cottages when I was there.
Mr. Stack: =
Yea, there was one. Some guy showed up in November and
decided he was going to stay there.
There’s no heat or running water.
Mr. Duplissie: I noticed the propane tanks out there were fresh,
that’s all.
Mr. Stack: =
Yea, he broke in, the Police were c=
alled,
and it just resolved itself. =
He got
cold and he let, but he was going through an eviction process. I talked to Arlene and Tom Traver,=
he
said he knew them, I didn’t know him, they didn’t know him, but
obviously he was there sometime over the course of the Summer through someb=
ody
who was renting a cottage.
Mr. Zawadzki: <=
/b> Any other questions? I guess we can decide whether this=
is a
significant activity.
CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 10, 2005
PAGE 9
MOTION:<=
span
style=3D'mso-tab-count:1'> (Mr.
Undercuffler, sec. Mr. Beauchamp) that Application #516 of Frank Stack for
reconstruction of an access way to remove junk cars and cleanup garbage fro=
m a
regulated area at 300 Smith Pond Road, Watertown, CT is Not A Significant
Activity.
Discussi= on: None<= o:p>
MOTION P=
ASSED
UNANIMOUSLY
MOTION:<=
span
style=3D'mso-tab-count:1'> (Mr.
Beauchamp, sec. Mr. Duplissie) to Approve Application #516 of Frank Stack f=
or reconstruction
of an access way to remove junk cars and cleanup garbage from a regulated a=
rea
at 300 Smith Pond Road, Watertown, CT subject to the standard conditions, t=
hat
we need a sketch of the masonry for the well and the repair for the dock, a=
nd
comply with the conservation easement, and no further disturbance.
Discussi= on: None<= o:p>
MOTION P=
ASSED
UNANIMOUSLY
&=
nbsp; C. Application
#518 of Daniel Hadjstylianos for construction of an addition to an existing
single-family dwelling at 1020 Main Street, Watertown, CT.
&=
nbsp; &nbs=
p; If
a Public Hearing is not held, then a decision is required by March 18, 2005=
.
&=
nbsp; &nbs=
p; Mr.
Zawadzki: We did a site walk on this on Febr=
uary 5th
and I guess first of all do you have any comments to us?
&=
nbsp; &nbs=
p; Daniel
Hadjstylianos, 1020 Main Street, Watertown, CT 06795
Mr. Hadjstylianos: No, I don’t.
&=
nbsp; &nbs=
p; Mr.
Zawadzki: Any questions for the
applicant based on our site walk?
= ; &n= bsp; Mr. Duplissie: I just noticed= that he’s going to be so close to the stream that obviously he’s goi= ng to have silt fence and maybe two hay bales, because he is going to be so cl= ose to the stream. He’s got= a little embankment there.
Mr. Zawadzki: Right, it’s downhill, right.=
= ; &n= bsp; Mr. Duplissie: So I think he = should do double the hay bale and the silt fence.
CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 10, 2005
PAGE 10
= ; &n= bsp; Mr. Rafey: The erosion and sedimentation control plan will be a part of the standard conditions that is included in the . . . . .
Mr. Polletta: To be best of my knowledge he̵=
7;s
not going to disturb behind where the addition is going to be.
Mr. Hadjstylianos: No.
The land is already compacted, there will be no encroachment on the
pristine condition of the woodlands, none at all.
&= nbsp; &nbs= p; MOTION: (Mr. Polletta, sec. Mr. Beauchamp) that Application #518 of Daniel Hadjstylianos= for construction of an addition to an existing single-family dwelling at 1020 M= ain Street, Watertown, CT is Not A Significant Activity.
&= nbsp; &nbs= p; Discussion: None<= o:p>
&=
nbsp; &nbs=
p; MOTION
PASSED UNANIMOUSLY
&= nbsp; &nbs= p; MOTION: (Mr. Polletta, sec. Mr. Beauchamp) to Approve Application #518 of Daniel Hadjstylianos for construction of an addition to an existing single-family dwelling at 1020 Main Street, Watertown, CT with the standard conditions.
&= nbsp; &nbs= p; Discussion: None<= o:p>
&=
nbsp; &nbs=
p; MOTION
PASSED UNANIMOUSLY
&=
nbsp; D. Application
#519 of Elizabeth and Gary Rebers for construction of a single-family dwell=
ing
on Lot D Butternut Lane, Watertown, CT.
&=
nbsp; &nbs=
p; If
a Public Hearing is not held, then a decision is required by March 18, 2005=
.
&=
nbsp; &nbs=
p; Franklin
Pilicy, Attorney, Representing the Gary and Elizabeth Rebers
Atty. Pilicy: They’re away on vacation that was scheduled
quite some time ago so they weren’t able to be here tonight. As the Commission is aware, weR=
17;re
seeking to locate one house on a building lot on
CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 10, 2005
PAGE 11
= ; &n= bsp; Mr. Zawadzki: Any questions f= or Mr. Pilicy?
&n= bsp; = ; Mr. Rafey: I just want to add something, if y= ou remember on the site walk some of the Commission members were concerned abo= ut the chlorinated water from the swimming pool and how they are we going to remove the water from that pool. I did speak to Robert Smith of the Torrington Area Health District and there = is, the paper that I gave you, there are two alternative locations for a drywell that they proposed. Page 1 it= is close to the leaching fields of the septic system, and on Page 2 it’s= on the side of the driveway. I d= id speak to the Torrington Area Health District and he said that wasn’t a good idea to discharge the chlorinated water into the ground, that will bre= ach the groundwater. They should = just leave it on the surface to run, and by the sun the chlorine will dissipate = and it’s much better to treat it over the surface instead of discharging = into the groundwater.
&n= bsp; = ; Mr. Undercuffler: Even if it runs down into the wetla= nds area there?
&= nbsp; &nbs= p; Mr. Rafey: There is a good distance, like 50 or 60 feet to the edge of the wetlands. By the time the water reaches ther= e it won’t be as . . . . .
&n= bsp; = ; Mr. Undercuffler: It’s not like this is happening continuously either.
&n= bsp; = ; Mr. Rafey: No. Once in awhile.
&= nbsp; &nbs= p; Mr. Zawadzki: Well I brought = that up on the site walk because I was concerned that we’d come out there 6 month’s from now and find a pipe leading into the wetlands or the wat= ercourse there and so that was what brought the issue up and I think that my limited knowledge of chemistry is that it’s correct, the chlorine breaks down quickly in the sun in pools, and that’s why it has to be replenished constantly. If you own a swim= ming pool you’re familiar with that and so I think that letting it out acr= oss the ground is fine. I think a= s a condition we would want to specify that no pipes would be installed towards= the wetlands, that the water discharge would be let out and allowed to run acro= ss the ground and percolate naturally into the ground.
&n= bsp; = ; Mr. Duplissie: Can we put that that discharge wou= ld be within “x” amount of feet of the pool, cause they could easily = run a 75 foot hose down into the wetlands, it doesn't have to be a pipe, but I think that maybe we could say that any discharge, like with a sump pump, em= pty pool or whatever you use, be within 5 or 10 feet of the pool, that way it h= as that 40 feet to run across the grass.
&= nbsp; &nbs= p; Mr. Zawadzki: That’s a = good point yea. They could conceiv= ably run a hose down there and siphon it out.&n= bsp; Yea, okay, I think that’s fair. I don’t know what this scale= here is, well they call it a 20 foot gallery but that’s . . . .
CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 10, 2005
PAGE 12
&n= bsp; = ; Mr. Rafey: You can make a condition that it s= hould be discharged as far as possible from the wetlands, and then I will go with= Bob Smith to see where is a reasonable place to discharge it and from there it = can go over the septic system.
&n= bsp; = ; Mr. Duplissie: Yea, maybe that they can’t r= un a hose more than 20 feet away from the pool.
Mr. Zawadzki: Not= to exceed, or something like that.
&n= bsp; = ; Mr. Duplissie: Yes, better terminology.
Mr. Undercuffler: This third page though, this was attached, if you read that it says that I assume (inaudible) dedicated pool, water leaching system, pool water.
Mr. Rafey: No actually if you look at thi= s, ground, yes, if you go on top, this line here, and it says that the least location from the ground for draining it says yes, D.E.P. allows that. For acid cleaning it says yes. For filtration backwash for privat= e pool it says yes, you can do that on the grounds, and for pressure wash it is allowed, you can do that for private, not public.
Mr. Undercuffler:= What’s the row up above = then for? What does that pertain to? Dedicated pool, water lea= ching system, pool water only.
Mr. Rafey:
Mr. Undercuffler:= Cause it says on the right, sw= imming pool wastewater may discharge to a leaching system, drywells, galleries, etc which do not receive sewage.
Mr. Duplissie:
Mr. Zawadzki:= Yea, actually this spells it out r= ight here, the D.E.P. says that discharge shall be 25 feet away minimum from any water supply well, substance sewage or surface water body, and that include= s a watercourse. Discharge should= seep directly in to the ground and shall not be allowed to runoff into any surfa= ce water body, again the watercourse, storm drain or into any neighboring property. That pretty much co= vers it, so I think if we specify that the . . . .
Mr. Rafey Yea, put a condition that it meets= the Torrington Area Health District requirements.
Mr. Zawadzki:= Well this is D.E.P. Does that sound reasonable?
CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 10, 2005
PAGE 13
Atty. Pilicy:= Yes, it does. That’s acceptable and makes sense. I don’t have a c= opy of that but I was aware of the issue.
Mr. Zawadzki: We’re referring to the third page. Any other discussion or comments?
Mr. Duplissie:
Mr. Rafey:
Mr. Duplissie: I wish everybody worked this hard.=
Mr. Zawadzki: Yea, well of course it was an= approved building lot and that was #1, today they might not even be that, but be tha= t as it may, it is an approved building lot.
&= nbsp; &nbs= p; MOTION: (Mr. Duplissie, sec. Mr. Jones) that Application #519 of Elizabeth and Gary Rebe= rs for construction of a single-family dwelling on Lot D Butternut Lane, Watertown, CT is Not A Significant Activity.
&= nbsp; &nbs= p; Discussion: None<= o:p>
&=
nbsp; &nbs=
p; MOTION
PASSED UNANIMOUSLY
&= nbsp; &nbs= p; MOTION: (Mr. Duplissie, sec. Mr. Beauchamp) to Approve Application #519 of Elizabeth and Gary Rebers for construction of a single-family dwelling on Lot D Butternut Lane, Watertown, CT with the standard conditions, and that the pool water discharge is specified per the D.E.P. and the Torrington Area Health Distri= ct, and the ENSA issues are all there.
&= nbsp; &nbs= p; Discussion: None<= o:p>
&=
nbsp; &nbs=
p; MOTION
PASSED UNANIMOUSLY
CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 10, 2005
PAGE 14
7. &n=
bsp; New
Applications
&=
nbsp; A. Application
#520 of Joseph Schienda for construction of four lot residential subdivisio=
n at
Slade Street Oakville, CT in an R-12.5 Residential Zoning District.
&=
nbsp; &nbs=
p; If
a Public Hearing is not held, then a decision is required by April 17, 2005=
.
&=
nbsp; &nbs=
p; Vincent Caterino, Engineer and Land Surveyor
&=
nbsp; =
; Mr.
Caterino:
Basically this application consists of a couple of things. One is improvements to an existing=
paper
street. The name of the stree=
t is
Slade Street and it hooks right into Cobb Street. Cobb Street is presently paved rig=
ht up
to this section over here, and we’re proposing to improve Slade Street
approximately 450 feet down to the end over here and build a hammerhead per
Town regulations. And along w=
ith
that we’re also proposing on revising the property lines of approxima=
tely
2 acres in the back over here onto 4 residential building lots.
Mr. Zawadzki:= The total parcel is only 1.57 isn’t it?
Mr. Caterino:=
Yes, it’s 1.57 plus there wa=
s at
one time .37 over here and then the area for the roadway was like (inaudibl=
e)
.2 so it’s like almost 2 acres altogether, by the time you figure all=
the
areas of the original parcel. So
what we’re proposing on is to this presently drains this whole direct=
ion
from west to east down over here, we’re proposing on catching the sto=
rm
drainage and catch basins and directing it to a sediment trap in a storm
scepter they call it. This is=
where
they’ll be removing most of the sediment from the storm water then
draining it down into a rip rap apron and into an existing brook that’=
;s
over here. The wetlands as shown on your map, you’ll see Wetland Flag=
#1,
#2, #3, #4, #5, and #6.
That’s the edge of the wetlands and the blue line is the exist=
ing
brook that’s there. The=
50
foot setback line is depicted as a red line as you can see on the map. It says 50 foot buffer to wetlands=
. And that’s the 50 foot buffer
line. We have no direct impac=
t to
the wetlands as far as filling the wetlands or disturbing the wetlands. The impact that we’re propos=
ing is
all to the 50 foot buffer. The
first area that we’re proposing impact to the 50 foot buffer will req=
uire
the construction of a storm manhole, (inaudible) and construction of a rip =
rap
apron in this area. The other=
area
will involve construction of on site storm water detention systems for this
house on lot #4, that’s this area here and the small area for grading,
very small area for grading, approximately 80 sq. feet for this here and I
forgot what the square footage was, I revised that and I gave it to Moosa.<=
/p>
Mr. Rafey:
CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 10, 2005
PAGE 15
Mr. Caterino:=
Yea, so it’s about 2,000 squ=
are
feet by the time you figure the construction of the underground storm water
infiltration system. For soil
erosion control measures we’re proposing for
Mr. Duplissie: You have 4 separate lines that wil= l be running up the street?
Mr. Caterino: That’s correct. These lines will be the total resp= onsibility of the homeowners. The Town h= as no responsibility whatsoever for the maintenance of these lines or the repair = of these lines. That’s per= the Water Department, that’s how they want to handle this situation. Cause this all drains this directi= on so it goes downhill. We can̵= 7;t get this by gravity going up this way so we need to pump up through the sew= er system over here. The roadway we’re proposing on this is 24 feet wide and it will have 6 inch curbi= ng all the way around the entire perimeter.&n= bsp; And all the water that’s coming down this way will be caught w= ith 4 catch basins and then directed again into that brook that flows this direction, north to south. So basically that’s it in a nutshell.&n= bsp; We’re presently working on some drainage calculations to deter= mine if we need a detention basin. We’re working with an engineering firm to determine that right now. We should have the resul= ts in a couple of weeks, so you can look at it at the next meeting. But essentially that’s it an= d if there are any questions at this point I’d be glad to answer them for = you.
Mr. Zawadzki:= Well the first thing that comes to= mind is since these houses are all served by public water and sewer, why do we n= eed to put the footing and leader drains in the wetland setback area. You’ve got a whole back yard = there?
Mr. Caterino:= On lot #4?
Mr. Zawadzki: Yes. I’m not worried about 1, 2, = and 3, but how about #4?
Mr. Caterino:= This is like the lowest point of t= he property, it’s all draining in this direction.
Mr. Zawadzki: Yea, but those are underground righ= t, so you could . . . .
CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 10, 2005
PAGE 16
Mr. Duplissie: What are underground?
Mr. Caterino: These infiltrator systems are underground, yes.
Mr. Zawadzki:= So you can slope them?
Mr. Caterino:= I could take another look at movin= g that up.
Mr. Zawadzki: Your contour is not down hill, what I’m getting at, you could put them downhill under ground.
Mr. Caterino:= Yea, you’re right about that= , I could take a closer look at moving these out of the 50 foot setback.
Mr. Duplissie: You’re showing a finished fl= oor elevation of 482, correct?
Mr. Caterino: That’s correct.
Mr. Duplissie: And a garage of 473.
Mr. Caterino: Yea, so we’re high up t= here.
Mr. Duplissie: So I’m assuming that the gar= age is under the house?
Mr. Caterino: Yes, it is a ranch.
Mr. Duplissie: I think what we’re suggestin= g is that the grade line on the back property line, just before it touches the buffer is at 470, so you’re down hill already just as you touch the, = if you follow that 470 grade line, it just barely touches your red line or your buffer line.
Mr. Caterino: You’re right, I’ll look= at that. I just (inaudible) I al= ways put these at the lowest point of the lots without really checking everything but it looks like we could move this up to here, out of the 50 foot setback= , in that area. These are needed t= o put the water back into the ground and not increase the runoff, so that’s= why we’re doing that but I’ll look at, but I’m sure we can do that, by looking at the map now we can definitely do that.
Mr. Duplissie: And you’re grading and hay b= ales, they go into the buffer area also. I see you’ve got a disturbance of what, 15 feet?
CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 10, 2005
PAGE 17
Mr. Caterino: We’ll it’s approximatel= y 80 square feet but it’s 15 feet from the house. We like to grade at least 15 feet = around the house, to put the grass and that’s a good number. If you notice I have the house pus= hed all the way up to setback line as far as I can, and the house is only 47 fe= et wide, so we made that house a little smaller cause normally the ranches that the builder builds are 50 feet wide, but this one will be 47 so we’re= not as close to the setback line, but to be practical you need to get around the house, there’s no way of getting around the house without leaving at least 15 feet, so that’s why we have the bales like that. We really can’t make the hou= se any narrower. 28 feet is about as narrow as you can go, maybe 26 or 26, but you’re really not picking up any distance from the setback line by doing that, so let’s just try to keep it to a minimum in this area and put a little silt fence and hay bales= .
Mr. Duplissie: The only other way to do it is to = flip the house.
Mr. Zawadzki: 90 degrees?
Mr. Duplissie: Yea, to make it . . . . 90 degrees= , yes.
Mr. Zawadzki: Well it changes the basic dimension= , yea.
Mr. Caterino:= That’s a possibility; I̵= 7;ll have to talk to the builder about that. You know the guy that builds the houses. I’ve seen houses that way, length-wise, but Ill see what we can do.&n= bsp; If we can do it like this, but it’s easier selling a house and= it looks better with the garage in the front, you know, it just fits nicer on = the lot.
Mr. Duplissie: Unfortunately we’re not conc= erned with the sale, we’re concerned with our wetlands.
Mr. Zawadzki: Plus the fact, I’m not a salesman either, but if I were down there I think you wouldn’t want to see 3 or 4 houses all identical. They’re the same size, but I’m sure they’re not go= ing to be all alike, but in any case they’re going to be close and that w= ould just give you a little variety. I mean a lot of Colonials are basically square.
Mr. Caterino:= You’re right, I mean we coul= d look at that, we could change that. I’ll talk to the builder about giving me a different footprint= for over thee and then for sure we would be out of that setback.
CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 10, 2005
PAGE 18
Mr. Duplissie: Our job is to look at the options = to get rid of the disturbance and I understand we’re only 6, 8, 10 feet into= our buffer, but the problem is that the 6, 8, 10 feet once you’re in construction, it becomes 20, 25 feet, and the trucks go around, and the concrete trucks spin around and the next thing you know you’ve got 50 feet that’s disturbed, so if there is some way to do it, and our opti= on it looks like is to change that, spin it around, and that would take you aw= ay from our buffer and keep your hay bales . . . . .
Mr. Caterino: Yea, I see what you’re saying= now with that.
Mr. Zawadzki:= Basically there’s no questio= n on 1, 2, or 3 lots. It’s o= nly lot 4.
Mr. Caterino:= Yea, and it’s a good sized l= ot too, it’s bigger, I don’t have the square footage of the lot written= on this plan, but if you look on the subdivision plan, the front sheet shows t= he square footage on it. It̵= 7;s half an acre, it’s a good sized lot for this zone. I looked at other options with this drainage. I originally was go= ing to drain it over land going down but we’re trying to avoid any erosion t= hat will take place, that’s why we’re proposing on what we have her= e. This storm manhole here will dissi= pate almost all of the energy coming out of the pipe, then we’re going to drain it onto a rip rap pad that will like 2 feet per second velocity, whic= h is very low, so there will be no erosion in this area.
Mr. Duplissie: What is this stream?
Mr. Caterino:= It’s about a 5 to 8 foot wid= e stream that runs all the time.
Mr. Duplissie: Is it a main stream? Does it feed into Turkey Brook?
Mr. Caterino: Yes, it does. This is one of the tributaries tha= t goes into Turkey Brook. Everything= goes into Turkey Brook. We’re presently doing a study on it right now to see what the impact is and how to handle the detention of this water. We’ll find out pretty soon.&n= bsp; The engineers that did the original design on Turkey Brook are looki= ng at that for us. We brought th= em aboard to look at that and give us their advice as to how to handle that detention for the roadway anyway. We’re proposing on site systems for each house to keep the increase to a minimum.
Mr. Duplissie: So at this point we’re not s= ure whether or not you need a detention or a retention pond at the end of this.=
CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 10, 2005
PAGE 19
Mr. Caterino:= That’s correct, yes. As it stands right now, from my experience in doing hydrology studies on situations like this, it’s my experience that we do not use detention basins, it’s best to let the water go as fast as you can instead of retaining it. In this particular situation I sus= pect what’s going to happen is we’re not going to have a detention basin, but we will use this storm scepter, which is a very good method of removing sediment and road salts from the roadway.
Mr. Duplissie: I just can’t see that they= 217;re going to allow more water to go into Turkey Brook when they’re just trying to overflow that thing before it’s finished.
Mr. Rafey:
Mr. Caterino:= What happens is when you detain the water, you can only detain the water for a short period of time, so you’re really not, you’re not really affecting the peak flood s= tage on the Turkey Brook, and that’s what you’re concerned with is t= he peak stage, which is fairly 12 hours into a storm. This is such a small site, it doesn’t make any sense to detain it for say 20 minutes or a half hour cause the water is still going to get down there anyway, so there’s really no way, that’s a very difficult situation to try and, you could have a zero increase in the peak discharge, but you’re still going to send more water down there no matter, if anybody that builds anywhere is go= ing to add more water to that area, there’s nothing you can do about it.<= /p>
Mr. Duplissie: But this is only the 600 or s= o feet of road that’s going in?
Mr. Caterino:= Well 450 feet. That’s all that’s goin= g in over here. The houses are goi= ng in the ground and over land to . . . . . in other words we’re not putting the leader drains into the storm drainage system, they’re all going back there like that.
Mr. Rafey:
Mr. Caterino: Some drains towards the road.
Mr. Rafey:
Mr. Caterino:= Yes those are all include. The roadway and all the driveways,= I believe, are going through the storm scepter and the houses, their roofs wi= ll be going into the infiltrator system.
CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 10, 2005
PAGE 20
Mr. Undercuffler:= Now, just to back up, this footing = leader drains that are shown on Lot #4, is that coming out of the buffer area now,= the way you looked at it?
Mr. Zawadzki:= He’s going to look at it.
Mr. Caterino:= I’m going to look at that ca= use if we have footings, see a raised ranch you don’t need footing drains, s= o if we build a different type of house on here, say the guy wants to put footing drains, you’re 8 feet lower from grade cause you’re in the grou= nd, and I believe by looking at it quickly, by you bringing it to my attention,= I can see that it’s going to be probably feasible to get it up in this area. I just assumed automati= cally that you have a nice place to drain cause it’s nice and low, guarante= ed to get there no problems, but . . . .
Mr. Undercuffler:= Moosa, once this gets filled now, w= hat are the restrictions on the setback area?&= nbsp; I know they can’t build anything in it, but they can use the setback area, they can have a lawn on it?
Mr. Rafey:
Mr. Undercuffler:= No, the wetland setback.
Mr. Rafey:
Mr. Undercuffler:= They can’t have a lawn there= , or mow the lawn?
Mr. Rafey:
Mr. Duplissie: No grading?
Mr. Rafey:
Mr. Duplissie: And if this is growth in that 50 f= oot buffer, this is 50 year old forest, they can’t go in and cut it down, they can’t even cut a tree in that buffer, correct?
Mr. Rafey:
Mr. Duplissie: So this house as it stands right n= ow will have a 15 foot side yard to the hay bales and a little narrow path to = the back.
Mr. Zawadzki: And some woods.
CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 10, 2005
PAGE 21
Mr. Duplissie: Yes, privacy, actually I don’= t know where it is.
Mr. Caterino:= This is all Town of Watertown land= , the Town owns all this land and it’s all very private.
Mr. Undercuffler<= /b> No, but in the actual lot #4, the setback area what’s on that ground right now?
Mr. Caterino:= There’s trees, a lot of brus= h in this area, it’s actually trees and bush, pretty nice.
Mr. Rafey:
Mr. Duplissie: Is they’re not going to go i= n and clear cut this?
Mr. Caterino: No. This is actually a very nice private lot, cause back here there̵= 7;s open space over here, over here and 262 is way over here. It’s pretty private. No one will ever build on this sid= e for sure.
Mr. Undercuffler:= What about open space set aside on= that?
Mr. Rafey:
Mr. Caterino:= Yea, we can.
Mr. Rafey:
Mr. Zawadzki: Also there was no list of adjacent property owners which I think is required.
Mr. Rafey:
Mr. Zawadzki:= Okay, well it wasn’t in my p= acket.
CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 10, 2005
PAGE 22
Mr. Caterino: It was on a separate piece of paper= I gave to the . . . . .
Mr. Rafey:
Mr. Duplissie: What is the percentage of open spac= e?
Mr. Rafey:
Mr. Zawadzki: Or a fee in lieu of.
Mr. Duplissie: You know in that open space, if we= took the galleys on 1, 2, and 3, and brought them closer to the houses, then it should be nice to have maybe instead of a 30 foot setback, is maybe make th= at open space all along the back.
Mr. Zawadzki:= That’s what we were just tal= king about, that’s a possibility.
Mr. Duplissie: They would have to pull the galleys closer to the house.
Mr. Zawadzki: Yea, because without pulling them c= loser you’d do a lot of excavating and defoliation. Well it’s a foregone conclus= ion we have to go and take a walk on this property.
Mr. Rafey:
Mr. Zawadzki: It could be in the deed, like the o=
ne we
just did on
Mr. Duplissie: They told me 1.57 acres, but still= .
Mr. Zawadzki: Well I think it will improve,= it will be nice for the neighborhood because it gives buffers to the neighbors too.
Mr. Undercuffler:= Is this map part of it or is this (inaudible) I mean this was a= ttached to the package.
Mr. Zawadzki: Yea, that’s where it is.
Mr. Undercuffler:= (Inaudible)
CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 10, 2005
PAGE 23
Mr. Duplissie: I don’t know how close it co=
mes to
Mr. Caterino: It’s probably 300 feet from <=
st1:Street
w:st=3D"on">
Mr. Rafey:
Mr. Duplissie: I’m sorry, yes, Echo Lake go= es the other way.
Mr. Zawadzki: Any other questions?
Mr. Duplissie: Is this the adjacent landowners?
Mr. Zawadzki: Yea, but we just didn’t get i= t in the packet.
Mr. Rafey:
Mr. Zawadzki: They provided it, we didn’t g= et it.
Mr. Zawadzki: Any questions at this point? We have a couple of options here.<= span style=3D'mso-spacerun:yes'> There’s a lot of missing information as Moosa just read, and we don’t really want to start the clock on this thing because we’ve got all this information that still= has to be submitted. We definitel= y need to take a site walk on this.
Mr. Duplissie: We can do that without the clock running.
Mr. Zawadzki: Correct.
Mr. Rafey:
Mr. Duplissie: Even though there’s a lot of information missing.
Mr. Rafey:
Mr. Zawadzki:= Yea, well that’s what I̵= 7;m thinking, we won’t schedule a public hearing at this point, we’= ll take a site walk and then cover that on the next meeting hopefully.
CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 10, 2005
PAGE 24
Mr. Caterino:= Yea, all those things I can get th= ose together real fast for you. T= he Engineering study should be done within a week. Chuck asked us to give you the additional study, so that’s why we’re doing it. But all of that information can be= provided well before the next meeting.
Mr. Zawadzki: Yea, because we want to have it in = our packet which we get the week before, and that way we have a chance to look = at it, otherwise we have a lot of unanswered questions and that delays it that much further.
Mr. Undercuffler:= Chuck has to go through it.
Mr. Rafey:
Mr. Caterino: Yea, we’ll definitely get tha= t way before the next meeting.
&=
nbsp; &nbs=
p; MOTION: (Mr.
Duplissie, sec. Mr. Polletta) to Schedule a Site Walk for Application #5
&= nbsp; &nbs= p; Discussion: None<= o:p>
&=
nbsp; &nbs=
p; MOTION
PASSED UNANIMOUSLY
&= nbsp; &nbs= p; MOTION: (Mr. Beauchamp, sec. Mr. Duplissie) to Table Application #520 of Joseph Schienda for construction of four lot residential subdiv= ision at Slade Street Oakville, CT in an R-12.5 Residential Zoning District.
&= nbsp; &nbs= p; Discussion: None<= o:p>
&=
nbsp; &nbs=
p; MOTION
PASSED UNANIMOUSLY
&=
nbsp; B. =
Application
#521 of Giuseppe Polletta for construction of 18-lot residential subdivisio=
n at
Echo Lake Road, Watertown, CT.
&=
nbsp; &=
nbsp; If
a Public Hearing is not held, then a decision is required by April 17, 2005=
.
&nbs=
p; &=
nbsp; MR.
POLLETTA RECUSED HIMSELF FROM THIS APPLICATION AND LEFT THE ROOM
&=
nbsp; &nbs=
p; Mr.
Zawadzki, Chairman, asked Ms. Sturgis to sit in for Mr. Polletta, in his
absence.
CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 10, 2005
PAGE 25
&nbs=
p; &=
nbsp; Franklin
Pilicy, Attorney Representing the Applicant
Atty. Pilicy:= I understand the Commission will probably be scheduling a site walk before we get much further into this, but Mr. Spath is prepared to give you a preliminary discussion as to what’= ;s proposed in a general nature, and the Commission will probably want to sche= dule a public hearing. We’re= not necessarily asking for one, but . . . . we won’t ask not to have one.=
Charles Spath,
Director and Principal of Stewart Sommers Company
Mr. Spath:
Mr. Zawadzki:= Well one thing that automatically = comes to mind is the easements for, you a have a considerable wetland area on this property and it’s fairly obvious conclusion to grant easements on that whether it’s to the Town or to the lot owners in any case why that can’t be disturbed in any case.
CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 10, 2005
PAGE 26
Mr. Spath:
Mr. Zawadzki: Well one question comes to my mind = and that’s you have an access way now, as I’m looking at this to the left of the road you have, why not come in there and do a double 90 and byp= ass that segment of the wetlands. You already have a passageway there.
Mr. Spath:
Mr. Zawadzki:= Is there drainage area, so youR= 17;re going to build it up, it’s going to be like a berm is there drainage = area would you have to put pipes under the road to (inaudible) drainage?
CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 10, 2005
PAGE 27
Mr. Spath:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> There’s a structure, this pi=
pe
here, that’s a detention structure there, a V Notch Weir, so it’=
;s
an outlet control structure for a detention area, and right here, this is an
outlet for the road drainage, so this would go in this upper wetlands area
here, and then would travel through this V Notch and be controlled through =
that
V Notch and then outletted down here, so this would, there’s a small
sediment basin before that also, so we’re trying to keep all the wate=
r,
because the pond is so close, we’re trying to use, you know be on the
uphill side of here and use that detention area to purify, not purify,
it’s not going to, but it’s to better cleanse the water before
going down into the pond. It =
is a
long travel time.
Mr. Zawadzki: I haven’t seen the land yet =
but it
just from looking at it, it would raise the question you need to, you
can’t block any flow of gravity or otherwise that goes from there or =
down
to the lower levels there so that’s all I’m asking is you provi=
de a
way for the water to go from that wetland to where it naturally would go.
Mr. Spath:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> That is that outlet, yea there is =
an
outlet there if that’s what you’re asking, yes, but we’re
trying to use that to . . . . .
Mr. Zawadzki: It’s there now?
Mr. Spath:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> No, there is nothing here. There actually is a pipe behind the
house that starts here, which I can show you that this wetlands drains into=
a
pipe here, then continues down this way, so we’re actually proposing =
to
construct this right next to this existing pipe, but we’re trying to =
use,
once we put in the road, use this as a kind of a natural detention area ins=
tead
of building up a detention pond for the water, it will work well.
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> I’m looking on your drawing =
here
and it says there’s an existing 18 inch RCP.
Mr. Spath:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> There is one there now that would =
be,
it’s in pretty poor shape.
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> And then right after it it says a
proposed 36 inch perforated RCP.
Mr. Spath:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> Yes.
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> So that would go down to a new det=
ention
pond?
Mr. Spath:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> Actually there’s no real pon=
ds
proposed. This area is going =
to act
as a natural detention area. =
This
driveway was built up a certain degree and this right here works well as a
detention pond on one side of this driveway. In between that driveway and where=
we
propose the road is the detention area that we’re looking to use, so
it’s not actually a pond that we’re building the road over.
CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 10, 2005
PAGE 28
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> So the end will just discharge,
you’ll have a discharge point at the end of that 36 inch RCP?
Mr. Spath:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> Yes, and that could be brought up
farther and could be piped underneath the driveway, but sometimes we’=
ve
found in the past that there is a panel and then try guiding it back into a
pipe doesn’t always work well.
We could do that , though.
Ms. Sturgis: I’m confused; I thought that=
was a
wetlands, you’re saying a wetlands is going to be your detention pond=
?
Mr. Spath:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> There is this green area that is s=
hown
on here, it's wooded area to remain, it’s actually like the clearing
limits, this green area. This
lighter green area and slight blue in here is the wetlands.
Ms. Sturgis: No, but I thought you said as you =
were
coming into your street that that was wetlands.
Mr. Spath:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> This is a wetlands in this area.
Ms. Sturgis: So that’s going to be your
detention pond?
Mr. Spath:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> It’s going to be a natural
detention basin, yes. We̵=
7;re
looking to drain into a wetlands area, use the road as a buffer or as a ber=
m. Instead of building a detention po=
nd . .
. . .
Ms. Sturgis: No, I realize I guess I’m
confused, but doesn’t that mean salt from the road and stuff is going=
to
go right into that little wetlands?
Maybe it doesn’t matter, I’m not saying it does.
Mr. Spath:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> No, before that area we have a plu=
nge
pool to take a lot of the sediment away.&n=
bsp;
There is going to be salt, there will always be salt and eventually =
what
we’re trying to prevent is anything going directly . . . . . .
Ms. Sturgis: Right into the lake.
Mr. Spath:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> Yea, and so what this does is it g=
ives a
good cleansing, and in this area here there will be a small here, and then =
into
this pond here, and I don’t believe there’s any reason to go in
there, it’s a wet bottom area now, it’s going to stay wet,
it’s going to act as a cleansing, I don’t think that we need to
build anything there, and that will act naturally. This you’ll see right now ac=
ts
naturally and the other side of the road, you’ll see how that is, and
then it will exit. We can sto=
p this
pipe sooner, I’d rather get the discharge point on the other side of =
this
driveway, but we could stop it in here and do a channel.
CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 10, 2005
PAGE 29
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> (Inaudible) bring it to the other =
side.
Mr. Spath:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> Yea, it’s . . . . .
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> In and out doesn’t help beca=
use
you’re just going to create more damage, more mud.
Mr. Spath:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> Yea, actually the channel you can =
build
up (inaudible). We are going =
to pick
up some drainage. We’re
putting in a catch basin up here and picking up some drainage which was Chu=
ck
Berger’s comment. I thi=
nk
they have a little problem up here.
I haven’t gone over it with him yet, but we provided what he a=
sked
for and I can go over a lot of these things on the wetlands walk, and I will
provide Moosa with probably 6 sets of plans, where we put the stakes, so you
can tell where you are out there.
I’ll be there.
Mr. Rafey:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> It’s a good idea to schedule=
the
site walk now and go see the site, and at the next meeting they’ll
explain these things and will be much clearer for them to see.
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> I’m assuming there will be
calculations done that there’s no extra water that’s going to h=
ead
down, there’s no excess.
Mr. Spath:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> I have a set of calculations cause=
Moosa
was asking for it.
Mr. Rafey:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> I didn’t get the drainage
calculations yet, but they promised they would bring it tonight and I will =
give
it to Chuck Berger as soon as he comes back.
Mr. Spath:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> But we have one here and on us rig=
ht
now, there’s a very slight increase.=
There’s an actual detention basin on the other side that we
didn’t account for and we take all the acreage all the way around in =
all
the watershed, and what happens is there’s an actual detention basin =
on
the other side of the road that we didn’t account for so we think
that’s going to bring it below by far but we did not include any
calculations. I’m going=
to go
over that with Chuck Berger and we could make that larger, but we’re
trying not to build anything here, we’re trying just to flood a small
area, and use that.
Mr. Rafey:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> Are the wetlands flagged on the
property? Can the Commission =
see
where the wetlands are when they go on the site walk?
Mr. Spath:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> Yea, they should be, they were fla=
gged probably
around August, so they still should be out there.
CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 10, 2005
PAGE 30
Mr. Zawadzki: Our letter says August was . . . .=
.
Mr. Spath:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> Yea, I don’t think anybody r=
ipped
them down.
Mr. Rafey:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> Can you check to make sure they’re flagged?
Mr. Spath:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> I’ll check that.
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> There was a crew out there the oth=
er
day, there was 4 or 5 guys out there.
Mr. Spath:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> They were staking the road and I h=
ave to
find out, I think they staked some of the houses and the discharge point, b=
ut I
have to be sure what they finalized out there.
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> I’m not sure, I can’t =
really
tell on my drawing, cause I’m having a hard time, but the discharge p=
oint
that you have going across that driveway is close to the wetlands, but
it’s not in the wetlands, it’s in a buffer?
Mr. Spath:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> Yes, actually on this property her=
e did
not have the wetlands flagged at the time we were looking at doing a differ=
ent
scenario and he’s supposed to go out there and flag these wetlands.
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> And you’re discharging just =
before
the Town of Watertown property?
Mr. Spath:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> That’s right.
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> And you’re “x” a=
mount
of feet that discharge point is a couple hundred feet away from the lake?
Mr. Spath:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> It’s pretty much farther than
that. The lake is actually do=
wn
here so it’s going to have to travel through these wetlands here, thr=
ough
here and here’s the lake.
That’s what we’re trying to do, keep the farthest away as
possible, for discharge.
CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 10, 2005
PAGE 31
Mr. Undercuffler: That house that’s there now,=
is
that part of the plan or will that be removed.
Mr. Spath:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> This house here?
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> Now or formerly Dwyer?
Mr. Spath:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> No, that would stay there.
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> Yea, that’s an existing home=
.
Mr. Spath:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> And this home here is also going to
stay.
Mr. Undercuffler: It looks like is that a new discha=
rge
point there?
Mr. Spath:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> Yes, it’s on that property a=
nd we
have an easement, we will have an easement?
Mr. Undercuffler: Is that an open or is that an
underground?
Mr. Spath:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> This whole pipe is underground.
Mr. Undercuffler: But at the end of the pipe, is tha=
t like
a little pool there?
Mr. Spath:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> Actually the original discharge po=
int
they had right up here at the pipe, and I asked John to move it back. I’d rather have the rip rap =
so if
there area any sediments that build up in the pipe the rip rap will collect
it. Sometimes we just build a=
small
pool right at the end of the pipe like this, and just catch a little bit, b=
ut
that’s coming out of the detention pond. There shouldn’t be, cause we=
do
not have any other catch basins here, we shouldn’t be picking up much
sediment. It would just be fr=
om
like turbidity when there’s a large storm here that if we would pick
anything up. I don’t th=
ink
we’re going to pick up much, it’s just safer to put it there,
especially because of the lake.
It’s probably not needed but I’d rather put it in there.=
Mr. Zawadzki: So now you’ve got another lo=
t #18
up there that fronts on
Mr. Spath:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> Yea, we’ve got one squeezed =
in
there, tucked in there.
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> Where is #18?
Mr. Spath:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> Right here. I forget about that myself, to tel=
l you
the truth.
CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 10, 2005
PAGE 32
Mr. Zawadzki: Well there’s a lot of wetlan=
ds up
there too, you’re well into the . . . .
Mr. Spath:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> There is an area here, this is the=
edge
of the wetlands back here. Th=
is
green is the stay wooded.
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> Is that a buffer?
Mr. Spath:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> Yes, that is to remain, that is the
wooded area and that’s the limits of the disturbance.
Mr. Zawadzki: Like half of the house is in the b=
uffer
area.
Mr. Spath:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> That is, and we have those every, I
think we gave Moosa a list of everything that, on each lot what there is, a=
nd
in cases like this here, there’s also one tucked between a wetland he=
re
and a wetlands here and there’s a house in here, we propose in those
areas, they’re not on the plans but we propose to put the stone walls=
in
certain areas like that, and those would be closely monitored during
construction. If they’r=
e done
correctly there won’t be a problem, but if you just give the permit a=
nd
someone is allowed to go out there and do whatever they want, that’s =
when
the problem starts.
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> What kind of stone walls are we ta=
lking
about?
Mr. Spath:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> Probably 2 feet high, dry stone wa=
ll, is
what I was telling Joe.
That’s what we’ve done in the past. We actually go out there, we stake=
the
area, they put in the stone wall, then you actually do an inspection before,
most towns don’t, but they come out and before they give you the buil=
ding
permit everything has to be okay, the silt fence. In this case Moosa would come out =
and
check that the stone wall is in place, and that way no construction goes ov=
er a
stone wall, and that would always be, if someone was to take care of their
lawn, it would be the stone wall is the buffer. The post work all right where it&#=
8217;s
more rural and not as close, but in a few of these cases, 18 and up here,
we’re close to wetlands and there’s a lot of wetlands on the
property and we’re trying to work around it, we’re trying to ke=
ep a
lot of green area, and to develop it right, we know we’re close, we w=
ant
to do these stone walls and monitor those so that they’re done correc=
tly,
not just have them do what they want.
It’s worked well in the past, what we’ve done.
Mr. Zawadzki: Honestly the first time I looked at
this, Lot #5 jumped out at me as being a nasty one. I think that’s something tha=
t you
might want to think about as a feasible alternative, is to eliminate
Mr. Spath:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> We’ll take a look at it out =
on the
field and I have to see it myself to tell you the truth.
CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 10, 2005
PAGE 33
Mr. Zawadzki: Just incorporate that into your ot=
her
two lots thee, because that’s just an extra crossing of the wetlands,
you’re in the buffer quite a bit.
Mr. Spath:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> That’s one of the tight ones
there, that’s the one I’m talking about.
Mr. Zawadzki: It’s a little ugly.
Mr. Undercuffler: Aren’t you exceeding the
regulations though as far as number of houses on a cul de sac? You’re only allowed to have =
10.
Atty. Pilicy: 15.
Mr. Undercuffler: When was that changed?
Atty. Pilicy: 6 months ago.
Mr. Rafey
Mr. Spath:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> Actually what the regulations allo=
w is
if you, this here is showing a connection to
Mr. Rafey:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> But if a cul de sac is close to the
intersection of the new road, to the end of this one.
Atty. Pilicy: Mallory Road off Woodgate is left =
to
extend in here. However we=
217;d
just as soon not build it.
Mr. Spath:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> There’s no reason to connect=
it.
Atty. Pilicy: I think everyone on existing Mallo=
ry
would be just as happy to have it stop there and hopefully the Planning
Commission and this Commission will agree that this can be done (inaudible)=
.
Mr. Zawadzki: Yea, well that’s not our con=
cern
but . . . . .
Mr. Spath:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> These areas here that I have as a
disturbance, that would also be staked.&nb=
sp;
That’s what we’re trying to leave as . . . . .
Mr. Undercuffler: You’re showing Lot #17 any r=
ate,
so that’s more than 15.
Mr. Spath:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> Yes, but with a connection then we=
could
have more.
CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 10, 2005
PAGE 34
Mr. Undercuffler: Except you’re not going to.<= o:p>
Atty. Pilicy: If we had to build, if the Commiss=
ion
could give a waiver based on we could do this, but we’re not going to=
.
Mr. Undercuffler: Well I know that, I’m just r=
aising
the question. (Inaudible) you=
want
to eliminate a lot here.
Mr. Spath:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> Yea, he wants to eliminate #5. But this area here it might be
confusing, this isn’t a wetlands here. This can be built very easily, but
we’d rather not, I don’t think its necessary for these lots, I
don’t think it’s necessary for an access there if you take a lo=
ok
at the overall plan, and they have access out of there and over there, but
that’s the Planning Commission who will decide that, but we wanted to
show it to you in case it does get approved that way, but I hope that it
doesn’t.
Mr. Undercuffler: The lot between 18 and the
Dwyer’s, is that all Watertown property?
Mr. Spath:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> That is the Town of Watertown righ=
t now.
Mr. Undercuffler: And is 18 that red house now?
Atty. Pilicy: The red house is over here.
Mr. Zawadzki: 18 is a new proposed house?
Atty. Pilicy: Yes.
Mr. Undercuffler: I’m sorry the red house is on
(inaudible).
Mr. Spath:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> Yea, that is a new proposed house.=
This lot is, this house is the one=
back
a ways, this one is the one with the barn right next to the street, and then
there’s a small . . . . . and there’s the drive. You’d probably either park i=
n here
or go in this drive, and that’s the area that I’m talking about=
, if
you had to rip that out take the 16 inch line out, put the 16 inch line bac=
k,
and you’d still have to build a retention area somewhere.
Mr. Undercuffler: When you go along there you look b=
ack and
I thought at one point they were building an access road back there and that
must be this area you’re talking about where they put the brand new p=
ipe.
Atty. Pilicy: Where they put the water line in.<= o:p>
CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 10, 2005
PAGE 35
Mr. Spath:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> Yea actually when you drive in thi=
s area
here, that’s the access to his driveway. When they put the water line in, t=
hey
went over the driveway and they went up here so you can’t drive up th=
ere
and there was disturbance, there’s an area up here where there’s
disturbance for the crossing of the road, but you’ll see where it is,
it’s been disturbed because of that water line already, it’s not
like a wetlands. The nicer
wetlands, pristine wetlands I would call these, are the ones before the lak=
e,
down in this area here when you walk it, and that’s what we’re
trying to protect with the discharge being up there.
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> That water line, where you’re
saying the 16 inch water line, that goes all the way through this proposed
development, correct?
Mr. Spath:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> Yes.
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> It comes out and then ends up . . =
. .
Mr. Spath:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> It comes out, I’m not sure w=
here
it goes after this point, to tell you the truth, it might go into . . . . .=
Atty. Pilicy: It ends up at
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> Okay, so it does, I have a hard ti=
me
seeing this on my drawing, but it looked like it continued on through.
Atty. Pilicy: It continues right down on French =
Street
and Gilbert Lane, down Gilbert Lane to French Street.
Mr. Spath:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> And you’ll see when we’=
;re
out there, the water line goes through a long stretch of wetlands, it
doesn’t really look like a wetlands, I mean it may be wet, but it
doesn’t have the growth and we’re proposing the road outside the
water line because, we’re proposing it close to the water line, but we
don’t want to get too close, so it’s on the up, we designed the
road to work with the water line so the road elevation is equal to the grade
that’s out there now, so there’s no conflict with that.
Mr. Zawadzki: Any other questions?
&= nbsp; &nbs= p; MOTION: (Mr. Duplissie, sec. Mr. Beauchamp) to Schedule a Site Walk for Application #521 of Giuseppe Polletta f= or construction of 18-lot residential subdivision at Echo Lake Road, Watertown, CT.
&= nbsp; &nbs= p; Discussion: None<= o:p>
&=
nbsp; &nbs=
p; MOTION
PASSED UNANIMOUSLY
CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 10, 2005
PAGE 36
&= nbsp; &nbs= p; MOTION: (Mr. Duplissie, sec. Mr. Jones) to Table Application #521 of Giuseppe Polletta for construction of 18-lot residential subdivisio= n at Echo Lake Road, Watertown, CT.
&= nbsp; &nbs= p; Discussion: None<= o:p>
&=
nbsp; &nbs=
p; MOTION
PASSED UNANIMOUSLY
Mr. Poll=
etta
returned to the meeting at 9:37 p.m.
Ms. Stur=
gis is
no longer sitting in for Mr. Polletta.
&=
nbsp; C. Application
#522 of James Pfeifer for installation of ground water monitoring wells at
Henlopen Manufacturing property,
&=
nbsp; &nbs=
p; If
a Public Hearing is not held, then a decision is required by April 17, 2005=
.
Mr. Pfeiffer: I’m here representing Henlop=
en
Manufacturing relative to their facility at 401 Park Road. I think my application is far less
complicated than the previous one.
We’re in the middle for the last 4 years, and I’ve been =
here
before to request access to the wetlands buffer for the purposes of install=
ing
monitoring wells for ground water monitoring. We are going into a new phase of t=
he
project right now and we have to install 4 over burdened monitoring wells a=
nd
an additional 3 or 4 bedrock wells at the site. One of the shallower monitoring we=
lls,
which is an over burdened monitoring well is going to be placed within one =
of
the wetlands that is on the southern edge of the property. Does everyone have the maps that w=
ent
with the application?
Mr. Rafey: Yes.
Mr. Pfeiffer: Those maps were based on a survey =
that
was done when it was an expansion that was proposed for the facility about 4
years ago. The locations wher=
e we
want to do the work are shown on that map.=
Only one of the wells that will require a drill rig is proposed to be
within the wetland itself. Th=
e rest
of the work within the wetland is going to be done by hand, so there really=
is
not going to be any permanent change or modifications to the wetland, but we
are going to have to access the wetland with a truck drill rig. The rig will be small, there will =
be no
requirement for tree removal or anything like that, so the purpose of this
application is to go in and install these wells, it will take probably a da=
y to
do the work, and then after that we will have a permanent well that we will
have to access by foot to monitor periodically, and that’s really the
gist of it, it’s pretty straightforward.
CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 10, 2005
PAGE 37
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> Why do you have to have this well =
in the
wetlands?
Mr. Pfeifer: Well we’re in the process of
evaluating releases that have occurred at this facility over the years,
relative to the activities at the facility back over the last 20 years. We’re into the phase of the
investigation now where we’re tracking a ground water plume that̵=
7;s
coming off the property and heading into the industrial park, into the GB
groundwater area. The locatio=
ns are
required because without going into these locations, I won’t have a g=
ood
feeling as the LAP on the project that I fully understand the flow rates and
direction of the contaminants that are in groundwater right now.
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> And with this groundwater well if =
you
determine where this plume is heading, can you take care of this plume or a=
re
you going to, sick well and try to collect it all in one spot, whatever this
plume is that you’re following?
Mr. Pfeiffer: (Tape #2, Side B ended – may=
have
missed some). To get a
snapshot. At the site and mov=
ing
across the utility right of way, which is located to the southeast of the
property. During this phase t=
here
will be no removal of plume, no changes to the plume, we’re simply tr=
ying
to figure out where it’s going, where it is within the overburden
aquifer, where it is within the bedrock aquifer and also the hydrologic
connection between those two aquifers, which includes the wetland area. One of the things we’re tryi=
ng to
do and is actually included in the permit application is the description, i=
s to
understand how ground water is flowing from the wetland down into the
overburden aquifer, and then eventually into the bedrock aquifer, and also =
if
there is any recharge from below up into the wetland hydraulically so
we’re doing two things, we’re trying to track the plume as it's
moving across the site, and we’re also trying to understand hydrologic
connections between the various aquifers at the site.
Mr. Zawadzki: How do you do that actually? You have to use dye or what?
Mr. Pfeifer: No we simply use differences in he=
ad in
the various wells, measurements and elevations of the water table. In terms of tracking the plume, we
actually collect samples from within these wells, which is one of the main
purposes of these wells is to get samples of the groundwater on a quarterly
basis, sometimes semi-annually, analyze that water in a laboratory and eval=
uate
the concentrations of contaminants within the groundwater.
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> My question remains is so you̵=
7;ll
identify the plume, you’ll find out if its coming up, going down, if
it’s being recharged, but in the end you’ll have that informati=
on
but the plume still plumes?
CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 10, 2005
PAGE 38
Mr. Pfeifer: Right, and the next phase of the p=
roject
will be a remedial action plan. The
information we’re going to gather during this phase of the project is
going to help us determine what the best remedial alternatives are, whether=
we
need remedial alternatives at all, it may be just a monitoring of the plume=
, so
we’re not to that point yet.
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> What is the actual plume that
you’re tracking right now?
Mr. Pfeifer: It’s chlorinated solvents.
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> What kind of chlorinated solvents?=
Mr. Pfeifer: Various. The facility over the years used
Trichlorethene, Perclorethlane, and 11 Triclorethlane. And at various times over about a =
20
year period. It’s pretty commonly used solvent in the
industrial park in general.
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> If I remember correctly those are =
all
heavier than water, aren’t they?
Mr. Pfeifer: Yes, only in denapel phase or
densiacrios phase. When it=
217;s
dissolved within the water it will move with the water.
Mr. Jones:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> So these wells are under order by =
D.E.P.,
in other words you’re required to drill these?
Mr. Pfeifer: We’re not under order by D.E= .P, but they are aware of the work that we are doing. I have met with D.E.P. on this issue. We’ve been worki= ng on this site for about 4 years now. They’re aware of it. We are not in any of the regulatory programs at this point, so they’re not driving the work. We’re doing it, and Henlopen is doing it of their own accord.<= o:p>
Mr. Undercuffler: According to your map here, it loo=
ks
like there’s 3 wells that are within either the buffer of the wetland
area.
Mr. Pfeifer: Yes. Within the buffer yes there are two
other wells that are going to be installed, but only one of the wells is
actually in the wetland.
Mr. Undercuffler: The potential soil boring monitori=
ng
well location, that’s what we’re talking about?
Mr. Pfeifer: Yes.
Mr. Undercuffler: The triangle within the circle the=
re?
CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 10, 2005
PAGE 39
Mr. Pfeifer: Yes. The other ones are actually just o=
ff the
parking lot of the facility. =
They
are technically in the buffer zone, but they are in a developed portion of =
the
property.
Mr. Zawadzki: Well this map shows some proposed =
soil
boring locations also in the wetlands.
Mr. Pfeifer: Right, and those are going to be d=
one by
hand. There will be no truck =
access
for those.
Mr. Zawadzki: So the other one, the one with the
circle with the triangle inside of it, is the drill like an auger?
Mr. Pfeifer: Yea, it will be an auger type rig.=
Mr. Zawadzki: How deep does that go?
Mr. Pfeifer: That’s going to be a very sh=
allow
well, probably less than 10 feet cause the water table is so high.
Mr. Zawadzki: So what do you do them, put a slee=
ve in
there?
Mr. Pfeifer: It will be finished with a PBC sle=
eve
yes.
Mr. Zawadzki: And then a cap or something?
Mr. Pfeifer: Well I’ll put a standpipe on=
it #1
so it’s easier to find, and because water gets so shallow and floods
during the Spring, these wetlands are more of a vernal type environment whe=
re
probably ¾ of the year they’re probably dry and the other thin=
g I
wanted to mention, we’re scheduling this work during the Winter period
when the ground is frozen to further minimize any potential impacts while t=
he
truck is actually n there, so that was kind of strategic also.
Mr. Undercuffler: So this is actually parking up
there? What is this back here=
? All grassed area I guess?
Mr. Pfeifer: Yea, the parking lot line is the c=
urbed
line that runs down that property line and then curves to the north. Beyond that is basically grass, an=
d then
there’s a gentle slope down to the wetland areas.
Mr. Undercuffler: So the circle with the cross propo=
sed
shallow bedrock that’s another one you’re going to dig?
CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 10, 2005
PAGE 40
Mr. Pfeifer: Yes, the 4 that are up closer to t=
he
facility are going to be bedrock wells, they’re going to be deeper th=
an
the ones we’re doing in the wetlands, they’re going to require a
larger drill rig. The well lo=
cation
that’s going to be in the wetland itself is a much smaller well, less
than 10 feet deep. These shal=
low
bedrock wells are going to be 40 to 50 feet deep and they will be designed
similar to a water supply well with a steel casing, a little more involved.=
Mr. Undercuffler: And only one of those is going to =
be in
the buffer area, the other looks like . . . . .
Mr. Pfeifer: The other one, it may be. It’s going to be close.
Mr. Undercuffler: According to the map it’s sh=
owing
it’s in the buffer.
Mr. Pfeifer: Right, and the other one is right =
on the
edge and you know. Let’=
s just
assume it’s going to be, so there’s going to be at least two
bedrock wells within the buffer zone.
Mr. Jones:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> You said you wanted to do this in =
the
Winter. I take it you mean th=
is
Winter, and this is already February so does that suggest you’re hopi=
ng
that we’ll act quickly on this.
Mr. Pfeifer: Well I don’t see this as a
significant activity. We̵=
7;re
not leaving anything behind, there won’t be an erosion issues. Anything that is generated during =
the
drilling process would be drummed and kept on site for proper off site disp=
osal
if required, if not it will be left on site and spread somewhere.
Mr. Rafey:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> If the Commission makes a decision=
on
March 10th, it will be okay because you cannot make a decision
tonight, in case somebody from the neighborhood submits a petition for a pu=
blic
hearing. Sometimes those thin=
gs
happen.
Mr. Pfeifer: That’s fine. I mean I’d like to do it whe=
n the
weather is still cold for access issues, but that’s fine, it’s
still relatively cold at that time of year.
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> I’m just looking for an elev=
ation
change, I can’t tell. C=
an you
tell me from the edge of the parking lot down to the well that you have in =
the
wetlands, how much of a chang=
e of
elevation is that?
Mr. Pfeifer: About 10 to 12 feet.
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> So this is a paved parking lot with
curbing?
CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 10, 2005
PAGE 41
Mr. Pfeifer: Yes.
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> And then you’re down 10 or 12
feet?
Mr. Pfeifer: Yes, it’s a gradual decline.=
It’s a good distance, but
it’s probably at least 10 feet down.
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> And you’re only going in the=
re with
one rig, it will back down into this hole?
Mr. Pfeifer: Yea, it’s a rubber tired 4 w=
heel
drive pickup truck sized rig that will turn 4 inch diameter augers.
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> And you’re not having to cut=
brush
or trees or anything to get into it?
I don’t know what the topography is like.
Mr. Pfeifer: Actually there may be a few pieces=
of
brush cut just to allow the workers to work around the well head, but no tr=
ees
are being removed, and if there is any brush cut it will be very minimal.
Mr. Undercuffler: Well we could always swing by on t=
he 5th?
Mr. Rafey:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> If you want to look at it.
Mr. Zawadzki: Yea, we can’t approve it ton=
ight
anyway.
Mr. Rafey:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> Are you available on March 5t=
h
for a site walk?
Mr. Pfeifer: I can get back to you, I don’=
;t have
my itinerary with me for the next month.&n=
bsp;
Saturdays, sure.
&=
nbsp; &nbs=
p; MOTION: (Mr.
Beauchamp, sec. Mr. Duplissie) to Schedule a Site Walk for Application #522 of James Pfeifer for
installation of ground water monitoring wells at Henlopen Manufacturing pro=
perty,
&= nbsp; &nbs= p; Discussion: None<= o:p>
&=
nbsp; &nbs=
p; MOTION
PASSED UNANIMOUSLY
CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 10, 2005
PAGE 42
&= nbsp; &nbs= p; MOTION: (Mr. Duplissie, sec. Mr. Beauchamp) to Table Application #522 of James Pfeifer for installation of ground water monitoring wells at Henlopen Manufacturing property, 401 Park Road, Watertown, CT.
&= nbsp; &nbs= p; Discussion: None<= o:p>
&=
nbsp; &nbs=
p; MOTION
PASSED UNANIMOUSLY
8. =
Old
Business
Mr.
Zawadzki, Chairman, read aloud the following letter from Atty. Peter M. Cla=
rk,
to the Watertown Conservation Commission Inland Wetlands Agency as follows:=
“January
21, 2005
Watertown
Conservation Commission
Inland
Wetland Agency
51
Depot Square Business Center
Suite
502
Watertown,
CT 06795
Re: Prope=
rties
at 563 and 603 Linkfield Road, Watertown
Dear
Sirs:
My
clients, Mark and Susan Coty and I are continuing to work with their contra=
ctor
and the Neibel’s attorney and engineer to prepare a satisfactory
application to address their concerns relating to the pipe installation.
Sincerely,
Peter
M. Clark
Cc: Atty.=
Gayle
E. McTaggert
&=
nbsp; Mr.
& Mrs. Mark Coty”
CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 10, 2005
PAGE 43
MOTION: =
(Mr.
Polletta, sec. Mr. Duplissie) to Table Discussion on Wetland Issues concern=
ing
Properties at 603 and 563 Linkfield Road, Watertown, CT.
Discussion: None<= o:p>
MOTION
PASSED UNANIMOUSLY
MOTION: =
(Mr.
Undercuffler, sec. Mr. Thermer) to add Agenda Item 8B, Alternate Proposals =
for
Advanced Auto Parts Site Plan
Discussion: None<= o:p>
MOTION
PASSED UNANIMOUSLY
Mr. Rafey: I have here copies of =
a plan,
they submitted 3 different alternatives.&n=
bsp;
They sent it today to the office to give to you, just look at them a=
nd
see which one, give them some feedback as to which plan is better before th=
ey
submit their formal application. If
you look at Page 1 at the top, I think you’re familiar with this. We had a site walk there, and you =
looked
at the plan. They moved the
building to the front of the property and the parking lot on the side in the
rear part, and they moved all of the activities outside of the regulated
area. The two lines on this m=
ap
that I marked as one is the edge of the wetlands, this dark line here, and =
the
next line is the 50 foot buffer zone, and all of the activities are outside=
of
the regulated area.
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> Much, much better.
Mr. Undercuffler: Yea.
Mr. Zawadzki: On all three of them. Of course they would have to encro=
ach a
little bit just to do the excavation into the buffer because they’re
within, looks like 6 inches of the line there but . . . .
Mr. Duplissie: Except for, if you loo=
k at
page 2 and 3, it’s just parking lot which is a lot better.
Mr. Zawadzki: <=
/b> But you have to grade it to level i=
t and
pave it.
Mr. Rafey:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-weight:bo=
ld'> I like the building to be closer t=
o the
wetlands than parking lot, on Main Street you don’t want the building=
to
be close to the street and the parking in back.
CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 10, 2005
PAGE 44
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> You do?
Mr. Rafey:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-weight:bo=
ld'> Yes.
Mr. Zawadzki: I like the top one, the first one =
with
the building closest to the street and the parking in the back.
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> I can’t tell from this drawi=
ng,
but it looks like you’ve got 6, 8, 10 feet from the buffer. And then if they have to encroach
another 6 or 8 feet into the buffer . . . . .
Mr. Zawadzki: Well there is a scale there.
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> Can you read it?
Mr. Rafey:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-weight:bo=
ld'> It’s very small, we can̵=
7;t
read anything on this map today.
Mr. Polletta: What about with the
building with plastic?
Mr. Duplissie: I don’t see it on
the drawing any more.
Mr. Zawadzki: Yea, one inch equals 20
feet.
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> Yea, but that’s on the origi=
nal,
not on this reduction.
Ms. Sturgis: The greenhouse is still there.
Mr. Rafey:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-weight:bo=
ld'> That would remain there.
Ms. Sturgis: And it’s two stories . . . .
I’m not supposed to talk.
Mr. Zawadzki: You can talk, you just
can’t vote.
Mr. Rafey: Just compared to the p=
lan
they submitted before, this is much better because they moved everything
outside of the regulated area.
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> There’s no more retaining wa=
ll
that was what, 6 feet from the wetlands before.
Mr. Zawadzki: Well all of them are an improvemen=
t.
Mr. Rafey: =
I think they didn’t want to h=
ire an
engineer to draw 3 different plans, they want to get feedback from you on w=
hich
plan you favor so they can just concentrate on that and provide all the det=
ails
on that.
CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 10, 2005
PAGE 45
Mr. Zawadzki: <=
/b> I mean frankly in terms of impact o=
n the
wetlands, they’re pretty equal and so to say we prefer one with the
building fronting the street is really not our concern.
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> Right, the fronting of the street
doesn’t matter, but I think as far as disturbance, you’ll have =
less
disturbance with the parking lot closer to the buffer because you’re =
not
digging down 6, 7 feet for footings and you’re not having to bring a
machine around the corner of the building.
Mr. Zawadzki: <=
/b> Yea, you just need to level it.
Mr. Undercuffler: But that’s just a one time t=
hing,
you’ve got to think about over the years you’re going to have a=
ll
that stuff.
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> Yea, the snow plow pushing over.
Mr. Undercuffler: The oil and everything else.
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> Well the oil should stay in the pa=
rking
lot and go to their catch basins.
Mr. Rafey: =
I think it’s better not to ha=
ve
access to that area by having the building on one side. They do have the parking lot there=
then
(inaudible).
Mr. Duplissie: =
So now if you have the building clo=
ser to
the buffer, they cannot do anything at that buffer, that buffer is a buffer,
they can’t put plants in there, they can’t mow it, they canR=
17;t
go in and trim the shrubs and as far as the Fire Department goes usually th=
ey
want “x” amount of feet for access.
Mr. Zawadzki: <=
/b> Well they can if we give them a
permit. In other words if we =
say
it’s okay, if they come in here and say they’d like to do
landscaping and put some hedges in there, and get in, that’s why we&#=
8217;re
here, that’s what we do all the time, so people can go into the buffer
area, they just can’t do it arbitrarily. They would come to us, if we give =
them a
permit, in fact if this comes to pass, that would probably come up in the
discussion and that type of thing as to how far, they would have to show on
their maps just like others have tonight what their encroachment area would=
be,
where their silt fence would be, where their hay bales would be, that would=
all
be on there and subsequent landscaping would also be indicated.
CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 10, 2005
PAGE 46
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> Well at this point right now, I me=
an if
we’re looking at this drawing and if I remember from our site walks, =
just
at the back of the building on your first drawing, on the first page, if you
look at that back corner which is closest to the corner, that’s in pi=
les
and piles of leaves and wood chips and I’m assuming they’re not
going to just leave those leaves and wood chips in that buffer and just lea=
ve
them there, I mean cause they’ll go all the way up to the wetlands, I
mean they went way back.
Mr. Rafey:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-weight:bo=
ld'> They won’t leave those there=
. Once they cut this piece and sell =
it to
(inaudible).
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> They’ll clean that up before=
the
construction? So he’s g=
oing
to go into that buffer anyway.
Mr. Polletta: <=
/b> What happened with that maintenance
building that was in the back? They
took it down?
Mr. Duplissie: =
It’s not on this drawing anym=
ore.
Mr. Rafey:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-weight:bo=
ld'> This is not a good map to read
everything on it, it’s just preliminary. Once they submit the application y=
ou
will get all the details, all kinds of plans, (inaudible) plan, drainage pl=
an,
everything.
Mr. Polletta: I like #1, the first one with the
building close to the site. O=
nce
you put the building up I think the less the disturbance in parking will be
away from the wetlands.
Mr. Duplissie: The other thing is for
other reasons, that driveway is further away from the light. The further away from the light, t=
he
less traffic will bottleneck too.
Mr. Zawadzki: <=
/b> Yea, that’s a good point.
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> Because that light is becoming ver=
y busy
at the corner of CVS and it backs up, so there will be even more connection
with it the closer you put it to the light the worse it’s going to be=
.
Mr. Zawadzki: It’s P & Z, =
but
still it’s a good point.
Mr. Duplissie: =
Well I’m just thinking ahead =
of
time. It may be only 100 feet
further, but . . . . .
CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 10, 2005
PAGE 47
Mr. Zawadzki: From a practical sense. I don’t know whether they wa=
nt us
to . . . . .
Mr. Rafey:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-weight:bo=
ld'> Just some feedback. I will tell Ms. Barton that the
Commission is in favor of Plan #1.
Mr. Zawadzki: I like #1. Does anyone else?
Mr. Jones:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-weight:bo=
ld'> I like that one too.
Mr. Undercuffler: Me too.
Mr. Zawadzki: It’s basically our opinion r=
ight
now.
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> The old house is not there, I
don’t see the . . . . .
Mr. Rafey:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-weight:bo=
ld'> There is nothing there, it’s=
just
a preliminary plan.
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> No, the shop is on the other side =
of the
street, the old 200 year old house.
Ms. Sturgis: That’s up further.
Mr. Beauchamp:<=
/b> It’s not on this property.
Many
people talking at once (inaudible).
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> I couldn’t remember which si=
de of
the street it was on.
Mr. Zawadzki: To the left of this drawing.
Mr. Jones:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt;mso-bidi-font-weight:bo=
ld'> It shows on the map, it says (inau=
dible)
Gift Shop.
Mr. Thermer: Bottom left hand corner.
Mr. Zawadzki: Oh yea, just a part of it.
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> I agree, I think #1 is probably the
best. I changed my mind. I liked #2 first, but . . . . .
Mr. Rafey: =
You don’t need a Motion on th=
is, I
will tell them.
CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 10, 2005
PAGE 48
9. =
New
Business
Mr. Zawadzki:
This is basically for our information. Nothing we need to act on.
Mr. Rafey:
Just make a Motion to accept this, or if you have any objections or
questions you can . . . .
Mr. Undercuffler:
There’s very little of this that’s in Watertown actually=
.
Mr. Duplissie:
But they have the right to go do this anyway, right?
Mr. Rafey:
They do it all the time.
Mr. Zawadzki:
It’s just for our information; they’re not asking for our
permission.
Mr. Rafey:
It is just a notice for the Commission that this is going on.
Mr. Duplissie:
And they can go in with these big trucks and just do damage.
Mr. Zawadzki: They
have a right of way, it’s like an easement.
MOTION: =
(Mr.
Duplissie, sec. Mr. Beauchamp) to Accept the Notice from Northeast Utilities
Service Company regarding maintenance activities by the Connecticut Light a=
nd
Power Company within electric rights-of-way in Town of Watertown.
Discussion: &n=
bsp; None
MOTION PASSED UNANIMOUSLY
Mr. Undercuffler:
There wasn’t any change here, was there Moosa?
Mr. Rafey: <=
/span>Every
year, when you have your election of officers then you review the by-laws in
case you want to make changes.
CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 10, 2005
PAGE 49
Mr. Undercuffler:
But there is nothing proposed at this point.
Mr. Rafey:
No, I just gave it to the Commission members for review, in case they
wanted to change anything.
Mr. Zawadzki:
Well basically unless you want to do it now, just read them and we c=
an
Table it until the next meeting if everybody wants to read it between now a=
nd
then, and if we have any changes we’ll bring them up at the next meet=
ing.
Mr. Rafey:
Actually one point that Ms. Barton mentioned, the Planning and Zoning
Commission has Election of Officers every other year, each even year they
do. I did discuss that with t=
he
Chairman and I think that would work with this Commission because your terms
are 3 years, or you can keep it the way it is.
Mr. Zawadzki:
Ms. Barton said she would email it, or something, because I saw it
myself, and she suggested we consider having the Election of Officers
bi-annually. My opinion is
it’s not a good idea because #1 it’s not any big convenience to
have an election, and #2 our terms are 3 years, so no matter how you do it
you’ll always have an overlap there, so somebody is going to split th=
eir
term. In other words if 2 yea=
rs
from now we re-elect officers and that person is on in the second year of h=
is 3
year term, then he’s going to end his term halfway through his term of
office so to speak. That̵=
7;s
just my opinion; we can discuss it.
Mr. Rafey:
I agree with that.
Mr. Duplissie:
Well it took such a long time to re-elect our officers tonight.
Mr. Zawadzki:
That’s my point.
MOTION: =
(Mr.
Polletta, sec. Mr. Duplissie) to Table the Review of the Watertown Conserva=
tion
Commission/Inland Wetland Agency By-Laws.
Discussion: None<= o:p>
MOTION
PASSED UNANIMOUSLY
10. Commu=
nications
and Bills
A. = The Habitat Connecticut Association of Conservation= and Inland Wetlands Commissions, Inc. Newsletter Vol. XVI No. 4 Fall 2004
B. =
Memorandum
from Council of governments Central Naugatuck Valley concerning requirements
fro Open Space in Subdivision Regulations
CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 10, 2005
PAGE 50
Mr. Rafey: These two items are ju=
st for
your information. If you look=
at
the back page, it shows other towns' open space requirements.
Mr. Zawadzki: Does that answer your question, Gl=
enn?
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> Yea, I didn’t know what the =
open
space . . . .
Mr. Zawadzki: Well it says at the top percent, t=
hat 10
is a percent.
Mr. Undercuffler: 50% of which might be hard.
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> Now how do you come up, it says or=
feet?
Mr. Zawadzki: Well for example in this developme=
nt we
just saw here 4 lots and a total of 1.57 acres in Oakville. There’s not a lot of open sp=
ace
available there, it may not be practical to say it should be open space.
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> So how do you come up with a fee t=
hen,
if you don’t do the percentage?
Mr. Zawadzki: Well actually that’s the Pla=
nning
and Zoning’s prerogative, right?
Mr. Rafey:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> Yes. The Planning and Zoning Commission=
will
look at the Plan of Development that which area of Town requires open space,
and if there is a development in Town (inaudible) they ask for 10% of the l=
and
for open space. Some areas th=
at we
have land for development, but there’s no requirement for open space =
on
the Plan of Development, the Planning and Zoning Commission will just ask t=
hem
to give 10% of the fair market value and a fee, and in the future they can =
use
that money to purchase open space somewhere else.
Mr. Zawadzki: That’s the other thing, that=
cash
can be used then to acquire open space because right now I think even the T=
own
feels that based on the Plan of Development which they are in the process of
redoing, it’s not practical for the Town or anyone to have these litt=
le
pockets of open space here, there, and everywhere; what they would really l=
ike
to have is contiguous property like some of those areas that are proposed f=
or
development right now, and connect them so that you’d have an area
that’s big enough for either recreation or passive recreation or
whatever, and that way you have a plan and so this might be a good example
where they would accept money if that money could be in escrow for future
purchase of open space.
CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 10, 2005
PAGE 51
Mr. Rafey:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> When you review the application yo=
u make
the recommendation to the Planning and Zoning Commission that they should a=
ccept
a fee in lieu of open space or you recommend open space for each developmen=
t.
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> And we recommend that they accept =
the
fee, so that’s not that we recommend it, but they don’t accept =
it
or they have to charge them the fee at that point?
Mr. Rafey:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> No, they don’t have to, but =
they
take recommendations from you.
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> Just for these 4 lots that we̵=
7;re
talking about, I know they said that this area was Town property below them,
but the back side of that property I didn’t see what was owned back
there, I didn’t notice that on the drawing, so if you did a 30 foot
easement or whatever conservation easement, if this is Town of Watertown
property then it would add 30 feet by the 200.
Mr. Zawadzki: Yea, it would, and that’s th=
e kind
of thing they might be interested in, if that’s the case, I don’=
;t
know either.
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> I’m only asking out loud.
Mr. Rafey:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> When you go on the site walk, you =
can
walk that part of the property and ask them who owns that part of the prope=
rty
behind this.
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> I don’t think it said basic =
there,
did it?
Mr. Zawadzki: No.
It shows, it looks like it might be unoccupied, but . . . .
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> Yes, I’m just thinking that =
if
somebody else is going to develop that back side at a later date, then aski=
ng
for 30 feet doesn’t really give us anything, unless those lots are al=
so
100 feet deep, and then you get 30 feet from their back, now you have a 60 =
by a
200.
Mr. Zawadzki: Everybody is different, but a lot =
of
people would like to have a 30 foot buffer on the back if there’s goi=
ng
to be another house right behind them, because it deadens the sound, it cuts
the site line, it gives you privacy, it does all sorts of things.
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> Especially if you could pick up an=
other
30 from them.
Mr. Zawadzki: But everybody is different. Some people love to have close
neighbors.
CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 10, 2005
PAGE 52
Mr. Undercuffler: On this Habitat thing, they talked=
about
there’s a new wording on the regulation. Do we need to, we do need to updat=
e our
regulations.
Mr. Rafey:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> I’m going to talk to you abo=
ut
that next under Staff Report.
MOTION:<=
span
style=3D'mso-tab-count:1'> (Mr.
Duplissie, sec. Mr. Beauchamp) to Accept and File Communications and Bills,=
Agenda
Item 10A and 10B, as presented.
Discussi= on: None<= o:p>
MOTION PASSED UNANIMOU=
SLY
11. Repor=
ts
from Officers and Committees
None
(Tape
#3, Side A ended – may have missed some.)
12. Repor=
ts
from Staff
A. Reflections at Echo Lake
Mr. Rafey: Phase II of Reflecti=
ons at
Echo Lake is under construction, and I didn’t put the other developer=
s,
Guernseytown Farms and Hidden Oaks because there is nothing going on. The ground is frozen and there is =
no
activity. Next month if there=
is
anything new happening, I will put them back on the Agenda.
Mr. Undercuffler: No big erosion or anything like th=
at?
Mr. Rafey:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> No, nothing.
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> When are they opening the road?
Mr. Rafey:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> The day after the last meeting I w=
ent
there, and there was only one house under construction.
CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 10, 2005
PAGE 53
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> Correct.
Mr. Rafey:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> And that lot has an anti tracking
pad. When the truck leaves th=
at
lot, there is a long road to travel to get to this other anti tracking pad =
for
the entire road, that is like probably more than 100 feet. Honestly I went the day after the
meeting and there was nothing on the road.
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> There was a lot on the road the da=
y I
was there.
Mr. Rafey:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> I checked with Chuck Berger and his
office and nobody complained. I
will take you there and show you how big an anti-tracking pad they’re
using.
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> I was on it. I was right behind the truck.
Mr. Rafey:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> I don’t know how that truck =
can
bring mud from that lot all the way to the . . . .
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> It was from the road, you know how=
he
has the asphalted road that comes down from the house that’s under
construction, it’s when he left that asphalted road, and there’s
like a dip in the road, like a ditch, whatever it is, and when he went thro=
ugh
there, that’s when he picked up the mud, and then he went over the tr=
ack
. . . .
Mr. Zawadzki: I wonder if he went off the path.<= o:p>
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> Well you could tell that he got re=
al
muddy when he went through that ditch, cause I went right in right behind h=
im.
Mr. Rafey:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> But the next day when I went there=
I
didn’t see anything. I
didn’t see any sign of mud on the tracking pad.
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> There was definitely some there th=
e day
I was there. I don’t kn=
ow how
long it had been before the meeting, I just remembered it was there,
that’s why I asked when they’re opening the road.
Mr. Rafey:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> The day after the meeting I went t=
here,
and then I called Chuck and asked him what was going on, but nothing was th=
ere.
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> Yea, but our last meeting was . . =
. .
Mr. Rafey:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> Those neighbors on Litchfield Road=
were
totally against that subdivision.
If they see anything wrong they will call right away. So far fortunately I haven’t
received any complaints.
CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 10, 2005
PAGE 54
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> Is when are they opening the road?=
Mr. Rafey:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> I don’t know. There is only one house now under
construction. We didn’t
encourage them to open the road because we don’t want people going th=
ere.
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> No, I’m just wondering becau=
se now
they’re going to have the construction, cause he has 8 or 9 lots sold=
and
they’ll start construction on.
2 or 3 are going in for permits.
Mr. Rafey:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> I can check with Roy Cavanaugh to =
see
when that is scheduled.
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> And each lot is to have an anti-tr=
acking
mat?
Mr. Rafey:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> Yes.
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> So now when they enter those lots,
they’ll be coming down that road, instead of coming out onto 63, they
won’t be carrying the mud onto 63, they’ll be getting rid of it=
on
this other road.
Mr. Rafey:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> Yes, but I remember at the last me=
eting
you mentioned it, the next day I went there and saw nothing.
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> It was in between when I got back =
from
my vacation and our meeting that I had been up there.
Mr. Rafey:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> Next time take some pictures and g=
ive
them to Mr. Calabrese.
Mr. Polletta: Right on
Mr. Duplissie:<=
/b> Yes.
Mr. Rafey:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> If you see anything, just give us a
call. Here is a few other tra=
ining
programs that I want to give everyone a copy of. This is the D.E.P. Training
Program. Any new member of th=
is
Commission that’s interested, please let me know as soon as possible =
so I
can register you.
Ms. Sturgis: I’ll go.
Mr. Rafey:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> There are 3 different programs.
CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 10, 2005
PAGE 55
Mr. Zawadzki; On the Land Trust one, we just hav=
e to
show up.
Mr. Rafey:<=
span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;mso-bidi-font-size:10.0pt'> I want to ask the Commission if yo=
u can
hold a special meeting to review the regulations and make some changes
according to D.E.P. changes to some of the definitions. This meeting will be held on Febru=
ary
15, 2005 at 7:00 p.m. in the Planning and Zoning Office Conference Room.
13. &n=
bsp; Public
Participation
&nbs=
p; Mark
Tedesco, 145 Hard Rock Road, Watertown, CT=
06795
=
; Mr.
Tedesco: I’m a developer here in Town=
, and
a certain issue has come up that sort of goes back to the Wetlands Commissi=
on
and I want to address it, and also keeping in mind I have no future project=
s on
the line, so this really isn’t for me, it’s for the next guy co=
ming
up – cul de sacs. Basic=
ally
what I’m here about is the islands.&=
nbsp;
When I approached Planning and Zoning, for instance Lynnfield Acres,
which was approved through this Commission, and I think Moosa can attest, w=
as
done without any complaints, or any problems whatsoever, it’s a road
that’s been accepted 100%.
When I went in front of Planning and Zoning about islands I was adam=
ant
against it. It’s not be=
cause
I have to put a tree in the middle of it, or there’s some landscaping
involved It comes down to the=
fact
that they just don’t work.
Unless you do something like Mr. Garrassino did years ago, a huge is=
land
with a big radius, that will work.
It will take up half your land, but it will work. In my situation with Lynnfield Acr=
es I
got a letter from the Fire Department, from Chief Black, and he’s dead
set against islands. When I b=
rought
it in front of the Board it keeps going back to the Wetlands Commission that
you want these islands because it produces less bituminous, less asphalt.
&nbs= p; Mr. Duplissie: The moving van has no fun either.<= o:p>
&nbs=
p; Mr. Undercuffler: I don’t recall the time I=
217;ve
been on we ever wanted an island.
CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 10, 2005
PAGE 56
&nbs=
p; Mr. Thermer: Mark, that never came up before us,=
and we
never requested it.
=
; Mr.
Zawadzki: I have not in the 3 years that
I’ve been on the Commission recall ever requesting that the cul de sac
have an island that wasn’t impervious.
=
; Mr.
Tedesco: That’s good, then I have
ammunition the next time with Planning and Zoning that I could say that I
don’t know, I can’t put words in your mouths, but the islands j=
ust
don’t work. The way
they’re making us produce them now, they don’t work.
Mr. Zawadzki: I live out by Deer Park and
there’s a cul de sacs in Deer Park, and one of them has no island,
it’s just a paved cul de sac, and the other one at the opposite end of
Deer Park has an island, and it’s quite nice, of course they have this
huge boulder there, and nobody, it’s as big as some of the houses over
there so nobody is going to drive through that one and it’s landscaped
and it looks quite nice.
Mr. Tedesco: Believe it or not, if you do p=
ut a
boulder it’s against the rules.
Mr. Zawadzki: Well it wasn’t then
apparently. I can’t say=
, but
in the time I’ve been on the Commission we have never asked that an
island be installed on a cul de sac.
=
; Mr.
Tedesco: Again their reasoning was that it =
was a,
maybe I’m all wet here.
=
; Mr.
Duplissie: It might have been because of the =
turn
around radius that they require, that if they put a small island, that could
accept groundwater and it wasn’t that much more bituminous asphalt an=
d so
it eliminated that, so it might have been part of the engineering in order =
to
do that, in order to reach that certain point to get off of the overflow he
might have made that . . . .
Mr. Tedesco: It seemed like they were putting i=
t on
your doorstep, so that’s why I’m addressing it.
Mr. Zawadzki: Okay, but again, I don’t arg=
ue the
fact that it’s less impervious surface, I mean there’s no quest=
ion
about that, but on the other hand we’ve never stipulated that, and un=
less
some engineering proposal knowing they wanted to minimize the impervious
surface for their drainage calculation, and we wouldn’t know that, in
other words I don’t know, when they present us with a drainage
calculation like these applicants tonight, and they say here’s how we=
did
this, they use in that equation some square footage of impervious surface.<=
span
style=3D'mso-spacerun:yes'> Now if they subtract an amount for=
the
cul de sac island, I don’t know that.
Mr. Tedesco: We’re talking about the size=
of
this area here, very small.
Mr. Zawadzki: I understand.
CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 10, 2005
PAGE 57
Mr. Tedesco: I take a lot of pride in the devel=
opments
I do, Hollow Road I know one of the Commission members is on Hollow Road, t=
hat
was one of the toughest developments I’ve ever done, just 3 houses, I=
did
a very nice job up there. Lyn=
nfield
came out fine. I got Watertown
Crossing across the street; hopefully that will turn out the same way. I’m showing perspective clie=
nts up
there and it’s just a mud hole, that whole cul de sac. Take a run up there, you’ll =
see
what I’m talking about.
Mr.
Mr. Tedesco: It’s not going to work.<= o:p>
Mr. Rafey: But the problem is with the traffic=
, that
it goes . . . .
Mr. Zawadzki: Well Mark, to answer your question,=
I
think it’s safe to say that if someone on the Planning and Zoning or
other agency can cite an example where we have specified that requirement, =
let
them show you. I’d like=
to
see it myself.
Mr. Tedesco: Especially Chief Black, again it=
217;s
a beautiful letter stating it’s a safety hazard on top of it. A lot of times his trucks can̵=
7;t
make the radius, they have to go over it, especially if there are trees and
shrubbery, on this particular island Planning and Zoning didn’t want =
any
shrubbery or trees, it’s just an island.
Mr. Zawadzki: But that’s Chief Black’s
concern, not ours.
Mr. Undercuffler: He’s saying the same thing.<= o:p>
Mr. Tedesco: He doesn’t want it for safety=
; I
don’t want it for aesthetics.
Mr. Duplissie: But once the Town accepts the road,
it’s the same thing that we talked about with the curbing over at
=
; Mr.
Rafey: It becomes the Town’s proble=
m.
Mr. Zawadzki Closed Pu=
blic
Participation at 10:30 p.m.
CONSERVATION COMMISSION/INLAND WETLAND AGENCY
REGULAR MEETING
FEBRUARY 10, 2005
PAGE 58
14. Adjou=
rnment
&=
nbsp; MOTION: (Mr. =
Beauchamp,
sec. Mr. Duplissie) to Adjourn the Regular Meeting at 10:31 p.m.
&nbs= p; Discussion: None<= o:p>
&nbs=
p; MOTION
PASSED UNANIMOUSLY
&nbs=
p; Regular
Meeting Adjourned at 10:31 p.m.
Respect=
fully
submitted,
Ronald =
Jones,
Secretary
Conserv=
ation
Commission/
Inland
Wetlands Agency
&nbs=
p; _________________=
_________________